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And I find both very unlikely? Where did @Lanefan explicitely state they wouldn't have an adult conversation with the player to unearth why they were interested in playing a dragonborn, before needing to assess if they were going to accept or reject it? It seem like you are inserting the...

But does it not then rather make it mechanics driven rather than player driven, if we use the same criteria for how to designate a "driver"?

Yes. I would be ok with working out something that looks like a thiefling and works like a thiefling. That still isn't a thiefling. You are still limiting away part of the defining lore. How do you know it is not this flavor the player is interested in? I would indeed find that incredibly more...

That might be. But if I declare a four-sided triangle, I would appriciate if you try to get clarification on what I am meaning up front, rather than go on replying to me as if I surely must have meant a square :) And less importantly. I absolutely reject your notion regarding limitations to...

I saw this now. I think I might have a relevant point before diving to deep into this rabit hole. I would claim neither text nor play is able to identify simulationist experience. I present chess as a case study. It can be experienced as a battle simulation. It can also be experienced as a...

Data can support me in making a decission. Data does not make a decission itself. A random roll might support me in making a more neutral narration. The roll doesn't make the narration itself. My role as a GM supports me in having my simulative judgment calls be accepted into fiction. This role...

While I instead of suggesting you take a car, would cheer you on and praise you for what good thing you do for the community (assuming there in this analogy also is some positive community effect like some charity payout per mile on this 1000 mile treck)

However it can still support simulation, even if it in itself doesn't have a form that do anything simulative.

Maybe. But can you imagine the experience might differ between those two ways of doing things? Isn't it great that there is indeed someone out there willing to put in the effort to enable that other experience for those that really know how to value it?

And I guess it would be nice if you react to being punched in the face by smiling and giving the puncher a hug. No analogy with the relevant case beyond pointing out that nicety isn't really a valid argument on it's own. To give a good comment on the situation, you need to achieve an...

Have you tried to look deeper, to see if there are any attempt at improved coherence? For instance the profilering of player spieces has caused at least some people getting into the problem that the settings do not feel credible to them anymore. The problem of what a backwater human dominated...

What is the reason for the player to insist on playing dragonborn, that is not similarly a red flag for allowing them into the campaign?

Ok. There we have it. If you quietly, but outright, rejected one of the fundamental facts of my example, and quietly replaced it with something you came up with yourself that you think make more sense. Is there any wonder we end up with differing visions?

There is a difference between being a thiefling and look like a thiefling. I want to be able to reject outright the former without that creating too much fuzz. The latter I can be very happy to work with the player to acheive. Who are in a position to not permit something? No, this one was...

I hope this sentiment is not pulling away too many people. I really hope to one day get time and players to enjoy the Arden Vul experience... Seriously. It is a completely different kind of game. You cannot say something doesn't make the game better if the thing indeed is the game ;)

This actually give me an idea. I think @SkidAce 's description is very close to what most GMs actually do. However it seem like the formulation SkidAce is using actually is more reassuring due to it being properly articulated. I think very few GMs would be able to with confidence formulate the...

This one matches my vision exactly. Indeed you have more vivid image in mind than me. So the difference isn't here. I wonder where you got those bolded parts from? I will give a stab at a speculation further down. But this do not harmonise with my vision. Indeed I have a hard time seing how...

Now we are getting somewhere! Here there are indeed a load of unstated assumptions coming to light :D This is seriously a WTF moment for me. If you think this has been established by anyone I think we might just as well have been reading different threads. I have not seen anyone even remotly...

Formally, no. But see my clarifying edit to my previous post. I think it is much more likely someone will have that mindset toward a 30 year magnum opus than a scetch. Largely because I would really believe we are then well past the fameous point where the world has started feeling like it has...

There is a difference between a rough scetch of a world, and a 30 year magnum opus in this regard :) Edit: There also is a difference in mindset. The mindset I portrayed here was a mindset I could easily see myself have. And that would indeed involve the dragon being irrevokably slain.