D&D 5E 2/18/13 L&L column

[Garthanos]

I never found it to be a problem. .

I want to create my own feel... its a tool not an end to itself.

Its less about what the game brings of its own as much as how the assumptions and screwball mechanics like vancian casting which basically prevent emulating any other fiction.

 

[Garthanos]

Hunh? Plenty of magical healing in legend and lore, and even history (as in people's beliefs). There was this one guy, he went around letting blind people see, curing leprosy, enabling the lame to walk...what was his name?.

Shucks never saw that one put on heavy armor. In fact the clerics archetype if he was a robed healer would actually have backing to millenia BC, including replacing arms that have been lopped off with cybernetic limbs of silver

Ofcourse most all of that stuff is after the fight not the trivial ping you are healed bit

 

[Crazy Jerome]

You know, if by default no single source of healing did very much, you could "boost" certain sources or pile on additional sources in your campaign to set the level of healing that you wanted. Maybe clerical magic does a little, herbs do a little, healing kits do a little, rest does a little, etc.

Then in those subset of games where a character wants to be the dedicated healer, he can play a cleric that has the skills and background necessary to make kits and herbs and potions to supplement his magic. That even fits some fantasy lit. OTOH, if you have a group were no one wants to do that, then the cleric is doing his part by having a few spells, and he can devote the rest of his character resources to being that war cleric or trickster priest or whatever. Then if the fighter, rogue, and wizard want more healing in the party, they can take some of those other options.

That doesn't solve the issue of an expected level of healing and what happens when it's not met or exceeded, but that's a thornier issue that requires some better levers than a running hit point total, anyway.

 

[Bedrockgames]

I want to create my own feel... its a tool not an end to itself.

Its less about what the game brings of its own as much as how the assumptions and screwball mechanics like vancian casting which basically prevent emulating any other fiction.

but if you don't like clerical healing or van ism casting and your goal is emulating fiction, maybe a game other than D&D is more up your alley (for me the very things you complain about are part of what makes it D&D).

 

[Garthanos]

Heck, there a plenty of people that believe in faith-based healing right now.

Faith healers talk about how what they do is dependent on the subject kind of like 4es healing which requires the healing surge from its subject - usually.(yes in real life they exploit the very real placebo effect which requires the subject to "buy" in to it but still)

 

[Garthanos]

but if you don't like clerical healing or van ism casting and your goal is emulating fiction, maybe a game other than D&D is more up your alley (for me the very things you complain about are part of what makes it D&D).

Gygax from the beginning encouraged people to build there own worlds and be the character in the novel or the movie... but the game carried pit falls towards that end instead of having a magic system similar to anything else it was a very gamist interpretation of a piece of fringe fiction (the actual Vancian magic may actually work better in many many ways which is very weird) Instead of having healing be a servant to the story and infrequent it is the master and required.

 

[Ratskinner]

Shucks never saw that one put on heavy armor. In fact the clerics archetype if he was a robed healer would actually have backing to millenia BC, including replacing arms that have been lopped off with cybernetic limbs of silver

Plenty of medieval ones in armor (according to legend, anyway.) It was a bit of a trope for warrior-saints (saints in general, really), kinda where the "cleric" class was inspired from (give or take a bit).

Ofcourse most all of that stuff is after the fight not the trivial ping you are healed bit

Actually, that would be my preferred form, as well. I'd like to see "wounding" be a triggered even at 0 HP (death being the worst outcome), and otherwise have all HP recover after a <specified for taste> rest period. Then the magical heal would be a much rarer and miraculous event. As a bonus, it would also better reflect literary and legendary tropes.

 

[Bedrockgames]

Gygax from the beginning encouraged people to build there own worlds and be the character in the novel or the movie... but the game carried pit falls towards that end instead of having a magic system similar to anything else it was a very gamist interpretation of a piece of fringe fiction (the actual Vancian magic may actually work better in many many ways which is very weird) Instead of having healing be a servant to the story and infrequent it is the master and required.

But that is still what it was for thirty years: vancian casting and clerical healing. There have always been other games that did a better job of emulating magic in fiction if that is what you were after. For me the vancian spell system is a huge part of D&D's identity and why it plays the way it does.

 

[Ratskinner]

Faith healers talk about how what they do is dependent on the subject kind of like 4es healing which requires the healing surge from its subject - usually.(yes in real life they exploit the very real placebo effect which requires the subject to "buy" in to it but still)

...and here I thought they relied on the "gimme your money, rubes" effect.

 

[Bedrockgames]

...so then you don't want a cleric to be necessary to gameplay, after all? Well, then, I guess we are basically on the same page.

No I don't think we are.

So your experience of D&D cannot abide the existence of a mechanic that, for instance, allows a fighter to actively parry a blow? And you believe this experience of D&D must be the basic experience of D&D?

of course it can. D&D has had parry options at various points. I don't object to parry on its own but I would object to baking in parry mechanics that are explicitly designed to get around having a cleric.