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20th level Sorcerer vs the world
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<blockquote data-quote="Hohige" data-source="post: 8175685" data-attributes="member: 7019463"><p><em>"An ordinary rogue with magic initiate is your equal with at least 4 of the skills with no resource expenditure 24/7 before factoring in any subclass benefits, races or feats. Call it stealth, insight, perception, investigation, and 90% of your approach mechanics turn into a coin toss. (Actually it's worse than that since at 20, rogues can use stroke of luck to make an ability check roll turn into a 20 1x/SR, which means if the rogue looks for you and you are present, they will find you)."</em></p><p></p><p>Congratulations, this is the rogue's job. But the Sorcerer does it better and It's a full caster with more spell known that Wizard's prepared spell and metamagic.</p><p></p><p>Rogue's Reliable talent is restricted to skills that he is proficient at. Skill Empowerment is for any skill. Trance of Order is for any skill, saving throw and attack roll.</p><p>So, It's Skill Empowerment to give expertise to every <strong>skill on the game.</strong></p><p>Magical Guidance to reroll failed skill checks (1 sp only, the level 20 Sorcerer has a lot of spells slots. reallly, a lot).</p><p>Minions's Help action for advantage.</p><p>Minions's Guidance</p><p></p><p>Yes, it costs SP. But that is not a problem for Sorcerer's Sorcerous Restoration.</p><p></p><p><em></em></p><p><em>"And there's more, rogues are this good at all of these skills at the same time. So while your sorcerer is burning a 5th level spell slot to be temporarily rogue-like in stealth, they can't be similarly rogue-like in perception so they are vulnerable to other stealthy parties."</em></p><p></p><p>The Sorcerer has Skill Expert feat (Stealth), Extended/Subtle Pass without trace, advantage, Shadow mark +1d4, guidance +1d4 and Trance of Order. It also has acess to powerful stealth spells invisibility and greater invisibility that is enhanced with Subtle Spell (not revealing himself). It's also hidden against divination, rogue not.</p><p>Also Spells like Ethrealness, Action to reapper + Quicken Spell is really deadly combo against enemies.</p><p>If he is detected, contigency spell casts Greater Invisibility and Seeming Spell allows him change his appaerence to avoid hostility against him.</p><p>This is enough to guarantee an infallible murder.</p><p>When Rogue attack It reveals himself. While Sorcerer's Sneaky Casting doesn't reveal himself, for impunity.</p><p>Sorcerer's perception is also strong, The Sorcerer can cast Skill Empowerment for perception to usu Search Action. It's 25~35+1d4 on perception check. Are you sure about that?</p><p></p><p>The Sorcerer is better, more reliable, a lot of resources avaiable, a lot of buffs allows him to incredible good.</p><p>Sorcerer is not only better than Rogue, no. He simply does everything better than rogue and with full casting spellcaster with sneaky casting.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Hohige, post: 8175685, member: 7019463"] [I]"An ordinary rogue with magic initiate is your equal with at least 4 of the skills with no resource expenditure 24/7 before factoring in any subclass benefits, races or feats. Call it stealth, insight, perception, investigation, and 90% of your approach mechanics turn into a coin toss. (Actually it's worse than that since at 20, rogues can use stroke of luck to make an ability check roll turn into a 20 1x/SR, which means if the rogue looks for you and you are present, they will find you)."[/I] Congratulations, this is the rogue's job. But the Sorcerer does it better and It's a full caster with more spell known that Wizard's prepared spell and metamagic. Rogue's Reliable talent is restricted to skills that he is proficient at. Skill Empowerment is for any skill. Trance of Order is for any skill, saving throw and attack roll. So, It's Skill Empowerment to give expertise to every [B]skill on the game.[/B] Magical Guidance to reroll failed skill checks (1 sp only, the level 20 Sorcerer has a lot of spells slots. reallly, a lot). Minions's Help action for advantage. Minions's Guidance Yes, it costs SP. But that is not a problem for Sorcerer's Sorcerous Restoration. [I] "And there's more, rogues are this good at all of these skills at the same time. So while your sorcerer is burning a 5th level spell slot to be temporarily rogue-like in stealth, they can't be similarly rogue-like in perception so they are vulnerable to other stealthy parties."[/I] The Sorcerer has Skill Expert feat (Stealth), Extended/Subtle Pass without trace, advantage, Shadow mark +1d4, guidance +1d4 and Trance of Order. It also has acess to powerful stealth spells invisibility and greater invisibility that is enhanced with Subtle Spell (not revealing himself). It's also hidden against divination, rogue not. Also Spells like Ethrealness, Action to reapper + Quicken Spell is really deadly combo against enemies. If he is detected, contigency spell casts Greater Invisibility and Seeming Spell allows him change his appaerence to avoid hostility against him. This is enough to guarantee an infallible murder. When Rogue attack It reveals himself. While Sorcerer's Sneaky Casting doesn't reveal himself, for impunity. Sorcerer's perception is also strong, The Sorcerer can cast Skill Empowerment for perception to usu Search Action. It's 25~35+1d4 on perception check. Are you sure about that? The Sorcerer is better, more reliable, a lot of resources avaiable, a lot of buffs allows him to incredible good. Sorcerer is not only better than Rogue, no. He simply does everything better than rogue and with full casting spellcaster with sneaky casting. [/QUOTE]
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