Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
White Dwarf Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Nest
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
EN Publishing
Twitter
BlueSky
Facebook
Instagram
EN World
BlueSky
YouTube
Facebook
Twitter
Twitch
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
3.5 Perform, Diplomacy
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="drnuncheon" data-source="post: 987240" data-attributes="member: 96"><p>Not to be rude, but...bull. There are any number of feats that one can take that apply with all weapons. Power Attack, Cleave, Great Cleave, Expertise, Mounted Combat, etc, etc. And if you think that 20 levels of fighter taking those feats is not a 'world class master' then, frankly, you have a really strange definition of the term. (Especially when this 'non-master' would hit faster and more often than a 10th level fighter with the 5 'master' feats you desctibe.) Such a fighter is just as good with the sword he has used every day for the past 20 levels as he is with an axe, even though he hasn't touched an axe since level one.</p><p></p><p>You can't tell me that the same techniques work when applying Cleave to a rapier as opposed to a greataxe. Hell, you can't even tell me that all of the same techniques work when applying your base attack bonus. (You know, the thing that fighters get with <em>any weapon</em> they pick up?) Your stance is different, the muscles you use are different, the timing's different, the weapon handles differently...and yet, you can use your full BAB and all of your feats (barring weapon specific ones) with any weapon.</p><p></p><p>Sure, there are similarities between the various weapons, but there's similarities in different kinds of Perform as well. Timing, reading the audience, reading the other performers, musical theory, improvisation...</p><p></p><p>Fighters are supposed to be combat badasses. That's why they can pick up weapons that are completely unfamiliar to them and still use them effectively. Bards are supposed to be performance badasses. Why <em>not</em> let them do any kind of performance well?</p><p></p><p>My question still stands: why is this level of abstraction acceptable for combat - which is a <em>huge</em> part of the game - and not for Perform - which is a miniscule part of the game?</p><p></p><p>J</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="drnuncheon, post: 987240, member: 96"] Not to be rude, but...bull. There are any number of feats that one can take that apply with all weapons. Power Attack, Cleave, Great Cleave, Expertise, Mounted Combat, etc, etc. And if you think that 20 levels of fighter taking those feats is not a 'world class master' then, frankly, you have a really strange definition of the term. (Especially when this 'non-master' would hit faster and more often than a 10th level fighter with the 5 'master' feats you desctibe.) Such a fighter is just as good with the sword he has used every day for the past 20 levels as he is with an axe, even though he hasn't touched an axe since level one. You can't tell me that the same techniques work when applying Cleave to a rapier as opposed to a greataxe. Hell, you can't even tell me that all of the same techniques work when applying your base attack bonus. (You know, the thing that fighters get with [i]any weapon[/i] they pick up?) Your stance is different, the muscles you use are different, the timing's different, the weapon handles differently...and yet, you can use your full BAB and all of your feats (barring weapon specific ones) with any weapon. Sure, there are similarities between the various weapons, but there's similarities in different kinds of Perform as well. Timing, reading the audience, reading the other performers, musical theory, improvisation... Fighters are supposed to be combat badasses. That's why they can pick up weapons that are completely unfamiliar to them and still use them effectively. Bards are supposed to be performance badasses. Why [i]not[/i] let them do any kind of performance well? My question still stands: why is this level of abstraction acceptable for combat - which is a [i]huge[/i] part of the game - and not for Perform - which is a miniscule part of the game? J [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions, OSR, & D&D Variants
3.5 Perform, Diplomacy
Top