D&D 3E/3.5 3.5 Update to Spellfire...

[reiella]

I agree with your fixes. However, the only thing I have heard about from PGtF regardling spellfire is the Spellfire Heirophant prestige class. I have asked repeatedly about it but nobody will give a response.

The only 'change' is the addition of the epic PrC Spellfire Hierophant.

The Epic Spellfire Wielder feat boosts your 'stored spellfire energy levels' by effecitvely raising your Constitution by 4 for those purposes only. It's also multiselectable, increasing it by 4 each time taken.

All the Spellfire Hierophant apears to do is add new abilities to the normal Spellfire range. Can drain items, ranged healing, haste, and a a spellfire burst. There's also spellfire reserve, more or less lets teh Hierophant store 'class level+CON modifier' in 'deep storage' that takes time to access but is in addition to the normal storage.

 

[Falling Icicle]

Actually, no. Spellfire is supposed to be a horribly unbalancing power--the canonical spellfire weilder, immediatly after taking her "Spellfire wielder" feat, destroyed a Dracolich.


A good house rule for Spellfire, IMO, is to give it a +1 / 2con LA.

(Rolls eyes).

Please. Spellfire is not horribly unbalancing. It is actually a very weak ability (except at lower levels).

And BTW, I've seen Wizards and Priests do some pretty spectacular feats of magical might in novels too.

Perhaps we need to unfairly punish spellcasters with a LA too? (sarcasm).

 

[Planesdragon]

Please. Spellfire is not horribly unbalancing. It is actually a very weak ability (except at lower levels).

? Dang.

You know of a different feat that lets you do as much as (CON)d6 damage in one attack, heal, and absorb spells?

You know of a different prestige class that lets you do as much raw damage as Spellfire Channeller?

And BTW, I've seen Wizards and Priests do some pretty spectacular feats of magical might in novels too.

Perhaps we need to unfairly punish spellcasters with a LA too? (sarcasm).

No, spellcasters are part of the core system, and balanced for it.

A spellfire LA is exactly appropriate. It's an increase in character power that isn't matched by any other prestige class or feat choice.

 

[Falling Icicle]

? Dang.

You know of a different feat that lets you do as much as (CON)d6 damage in one attack, heal, and absorb spells?

You know of a different prestige class that lets you do as much raw damage as Spellfire Channeller?

No, spellcasters are part of the core system, and balanced for it.

A spellfire LA is exactly appropriate. It's an increase in character power that isn't matched by any other prestige class or feat choice.

Please. Lets compare a Spellfire and a Wizard or Sorcerer shall we? You think the ability to do (CON) d6 damage to a single creature is THAT impressive that you would inflict a LA on one? Look at the 2nd level Scorching Ray spell for crying out loud! Look at Fireball! Look at Meteor Swarm! Look at the Simbul's Synostodweomer if you want to talk about how "amazing" the healing ability of a Spellfire is! Look at the fly spell! Look at the Absorption and Spell reflection spells. Hell, look at Magic Missile for that matter!

Look long and hard, my friend. And then honestly tell me you would inflict an obscene LA on a Spellfire Channeler. If you would, well then there is no use in even discussing this further with you.

I've played a Spellfire Channeler before. And believe me, I spent the entire time overshadowed by every other Spellcaster, Rogue, Fighter, etc in the group. Wow. I can inflict 18d6 damage on ONE creature. Wow I can heal a few d4 damage. Wow I can fly for a few minutes. Wow, I can do about the equivalent of Flame Aura on myself. Oh wait, it costs me 10!!! Spellfire Energy levels per round to do that...

Too bad I have to go around begging the other spellcasters to use up their spells on me just so I can do that! Oh, and not to mention being hunted by the Cult of the Dragon, Red WIzards, and just about everyone else who wants to recruit, study, and/or experiment on me! All that for a small number of abilities that, while useful, are pathetic compared to the arsenal of powerful abilities I could have had as a Spellcaster.

The only time the Spellfire feat is unbalanced is at low levels. The ability to do 18d6 damage at level one is insane. The ability to do 18d6 damage at level 20 won't impress anyone.

 

[Planesdragon]

You think the ability to do (CON) d6 damage to a single creature is THAT impressive that you would inflict a LA on one?

Yes. A spellfire weilder built to run spellfire can beat out any other single character of the same level. And if they "just happen to" have spellfire, they're still very impressive.

CON/2 may be a bit too much--but +1 LA or +2 LA isn't.

All that for a small number of abilities that, while useful, are pathetic compared to the arsenal of powerful abilities I could have had as a Spellcaster.

? You can be a spellcaster and a spellfire wielder. A sorceror/spellfire wielder would be a nice combination, as would a number of other classes.

 

[James McMurray]

An Arcane Trickster with spellfire would be nice. I hear ranged touch sneak attacks are good.

 

[Falling Icicle]

Yes. A spellfire weilder built to run spellfire can beat out any other single character of the same level.

I totally disagree with that statement. But there is no sense in dragging on a pointless debate over 10 pages just to argue this one point.

And if they "just happen to" have spellfire, they're still very impressive.

I've never said anything to the contrary. Only that it isn't so powerful as to be worthy of an insane LA.

CON/2 may be a bit too much--but +1 LA or +2 LA isn't.

May be? Spellfire is not worth a level adjustment as high as 9 (or more) levels. A +1 or +2 LA would be acceptable, but in that case it should be treated as any other template and not require the purchase of the Spellfire Weilder feat.

? You can be a spellcaster and a spellfire wielder. A sorceror/spellfire wielder would be a nice combination, as would a number of other classes.

That is true. But once you hit 10th level, Spellfire is a pretty insignificant boost of capability to a spellcaster. An nice plus, absolutely. But it is certainly not worth devoting 10 levels to the Spellfire Channeler prestige class and its pathetic abilities when you could get 10 levels in another class instead. I'll take a Wizard 20 over a Wizard 10/Spellfire Channeler 10 any day.
Maybe it's just me, but I would take Meteor Swarm and Mind Blank and all those other high levels spells over the ability to fly and surround myself in a crown of fire for a couple rounds.

The Spellfire Weilder feat is among the most powerful feats in the game. But, on the flip side, the Spellfire Channler is among the most worthless and pathetic classes in the game. And before you go giving Spellfire Weilders a LA, take into consideration that there are roleplaying drawbacks to being a Spellfire that no other feat imposes on a character.

 

[Celtavian]

re

The only spellfire wielder I have ever seen run was fairly weak, especially as he reached higher level. The most often used spells by enemy spell casters are area of effect spells, which spellfire wielders can't absorb. When some wizard or cleric does decide to target you with individual spells, the spellfire wielder is often not ready to absorb the incoming spell.

All in all, spellfire is only good for a blast or two, then its all used up. It in no way gives the feel of wielding spellfire as the girl in Greenwood's book.

 

[Li Shenron]

Is this a specific rule for FR? I think the idea for non setting-specific material was that everything that doesn't receive an update by 3.5 books is to be considered obsolete and NOT to be used in 3.5. That obviously doesn't apply for flavor or non-rule material.

As a matter of fact now I think that it's not the same for FR... there is so much material already published that the rule should be that if it is NOT updated by PGtF - or future books - then it can still be played as it was in 3.0.