[3.5E] Change to Track feat?

[MerricB]

I am not sure of the particulars in Life's Bizzare, but you can use the Search skill now with the Track feat if you don't have Wilderness Lore, if the DC is 10 or less.

Not quite true.

If you don't have the Track feat, you may use the Search skill if the DC is 10 or less.

From the SRD:
Track
Normal: A character without this feat can use the Search skill to find tracks, but can only follow tracks if the DC is 10 or less.

Originally posted by fusangite
Track should be a skill not a feat. Tumble should be a feat not a skill.

Track is an extension of the Wilderness Lore (or Search) skill: it adds new capabilities to the skill.

Rogues have an extension to the Search skill - they can find magical traps and traps with a DC of above 20.

What skill is Tumble an extension of?

The skill provides the possibility of failure.

Cheers!

 

[Ravellion]

What skill is Tumble an extension of?

The skill provides the possibility of failure.

Cheers!

So would a reflex save at (15+tumbler's Dex modifier) for still making an AoO. Alow for an improved tumble which sets it at (20+tumbler's Dex modifier).

Not that hard. And this Feat actually allows for failure... the skill doesn't as natural 1s aren't an automatic failure, and +14 is very easy to get quickly because of the synergy bonusses.

Rav

 

[JRRNeiklot]

I don't like this change. I like rangers (even if they do force twf on them, but I regress), but I envision them as using their instincts and just noticing stuff others miss. Now rangers will be able to find secret doors as easily as thieves, which is just wrong. In the wilderness, a ranger should be king, in a dungeon, not so much. Tracking shoud be a bit more mystical than just meticulously searching for clues. I want Arragorn, not Sherlock Holmes.

 

[Tsyr]

I'm gonna have to side with JRRNeiklot... I mean, logicly, yes, Search probably makes more sense... But from a purely "feel" standpoint, I like it being Wilderness Lore better... It limits tracking more to woodsy or at least "outdoorsy" characters... If it's search, a city-born theif who is good at spotting the complex traps in the house of highborn nobles and at spotting coin-pouches on rich merchants is, with the track feat, as good at tracking as a ranger born and bred in the wilderness. I mean, certainly, I can see Search giving a synergy bonus, but... no. I really prefer Wild Lore, and will house rule it back if they change it.

 

[Chroma]

Tumble trouble

What skill is Tumble an extension of?

Tumble should have have been made a feat based on the Balance skill, just like Track for Wilderness Lore.

Just my two cents.

 

[Tsyr]

Actualy, I think tumble, in some form, should be kept a skill... but rename it acrobatics or something, so it becomes far more versitile... There really needs to be a skill for things that don't fall into "jumping" or "balance"... contortion, gymnastics, summersaults, etc.

 

[hong]

I don't like this change. I like rangers (even if they do force twf on them, but I regress), but I envision them as using their instincts and just noticing stuff others miss. Now rangers will be able to find secret doors as easily as thieves, which is just wrong. In the wilderness, a ranger should be king, in a dungeon, not so much. Tracking shoud be a bit more mystical than just meticulously searching for clues. I want Arragorn, not Sherlock Holmes.

Tracking isn't very mystical at all. It's just looking for subtle clues in the landscape, that get missed by less skilled/experienced people. It only looks mystical to you because you're an urban dweller who doesn't know much about tracking.

If you want rangers to be better at finding tracks, and rogues to be better at finding secret doors, then circumstance bonuses provide a simple solution to that.

 

[Frostmarrow]

I don't like this change. I like rangers (even if they do force twf on them, but I regress), but I envision them as using their instincts and just noticing stuff others miss. Now rangers will be able to find secret doors as easily as thieves, which is just wrong. In the wilderness, a ranger should be king, in a dungeon, not so much. Tracking shoud be a bit more mystical than just meticulously searching for clues. I want Arragorn, not Sherlock Holmes.

Contrary to JRRNeiklot I really like this change. I've always thought it was strange that a ranger's skills are better in the wild than anywhere else. If a rogue is trained in an urban environment and still is equally effective in a dungeon a ranger should be able to put equally good use of his wilderness skills there too.

I like to think that it is the player who adds mystery to his character. Let's here from some more people. Should a ranger be as good in a dungeon as he is in the wilderness?

 

[Staffan]

I am personally considering a house rule that lets anyone track using Wilderness Lore, and have the Track feat add +4 to the skill when tracking. This mimics Concentration/Combat Casting - anyone can use Concentration to cast defensively, but Combat Casting gives +4.

If Skill Focus increases to +3, the Combat Casting and Track bonus might have to increase to +5.

 

[Zerovoid]

Yes, Wilderness Lore has been (will be) changed to Survival.

I seem to remember Intuit Direction also being folded into Survival, but that might just be my imagination going wild. (I really hope it is the case, actually).

That's seven skills you list there... assuming that one of them might be jettisoned without problem, it'd imply 6 skill points per level for a ranger.

Cheers!

I really hope they keep the ranger at 4 skill points. With d10 hit dice, and full fighter BAB, they really don't deserve more than 4. If you want those skills, how about not using Intelligence as a dump stat?

IMHO any class that can get all the skills they want automatically has too many skill points.