D&D 3E/3.5 [3.5e] New rules from Savage Species

[drnuncheon]

I would expect that any class that did/didn't have alchemy as a class skill will be the same for Craft (Alchemy), regardless of access to the Craft skill. Just like how Knowledge (Religion), Knowledge (Nature) and Knowledge (Arcana) are kept seperate from Knowledge (Any).

...except that classes with Knowledge (any) can have any of those. So really, what you suggest is the reverse, making Craft (any) into Craft (any but Alchemy).

J

 

[Dr. Zoom]

Re: Re: Re: [3.5e] New rules from Savage Species

Check out the Wight template.

I just noticed that the Stench ability listed for the sample trog wight is pre-errata. The MM errata changes the strength loss to a -2 morale penalty on attacks, damage, skills, and checks.

 

[The Little Raven]

9) Energy drain (as possessed by wights and spectres) allows a Fort save to avoid taking negative levels.

Are you sure it's a Fortitude save to avoid gaining negative levels, or a Fortitude save to REMOVE negative levels?

Dungeons & Dragons 3rd Edition Dungeon Master's Guide, page 76, first column, 1st bullet.

"Negative levels remain for 24 hours or until removed with a spell, such as restoration. After 24 hours, the afflicted creature must attempt a Fortitude save. The DC is 10 + one-half the attacker's Hit Dice + the attacker's Charisma modifier. If the saving throw succeeds, the negative level goes away with no harm to the creature. If the save fails, the negative level goes away, but the creature's level is also reduced by 1. The afflicted creature makes a separate saving throw for each negative level it has gained."

According to the current rules, you get a save to remove negative levels. How is it any different in Savage Species?

 

[Crothian]

Re: Re: [3.5e] New rules from Savage Species

According to the current rules, you get a save to remove negative levels. How is it any different in Savage Species?

SS seems to also say that you get a fort save at the onset to never get those negative levels. DMG just says you get the fort save after 24 hours.

 

[The Little Raven]

Re: Re: Re: [3.5e] New rules from Savage Species

I don't like the rule at all. This seriously screws most vampires and other stuff... gonna add some character levels to them to make up for it.

Well, if what is said is true, how are vampires screwed?

They don't do two automatic negative levels, but they can do FOUR negative levels, and if they're high HD and high Charisma, this won't be a problem.

Also, don't forget ALL THE OTHER BENEFITS THEY GET. After all, it could drain Constitution and kill some characters faster than others. Of course the +6 Strength doesn't hurt, either...

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

Energy Drain seemed to me overpowered as it was - I once used some Vampires and Vampire Spawns against my group, and it was really terrifying - a few hits, and the character was/is really screwed. Near death, low fighting abilities, and no chance to avoid it (you can`t get your AC high enoguh )

Everybody will prefer having a chance to make a Save to avoid the level loss at all ...

 

[Andion Isurand]

I don't know where I first heard these... but for some reason, they feel correct enough to post.

10) Decipher Script is now a Wizard skill.

11) Intimidate is now a Fighter skill.

 

[Janos Antero]

Honestly, good riddens to ability drain and level drain without some chance of avoidance. Average fighter, despite some great combat related abilities, has a very limited way of removing preventing any drain, and it takes days to get the full potential back. If ability drain healed faster it wouldn't be so bad, but that isn't always an option.

Best example of this was one fight against Shadows (theoretically, I don't remember the actual specifics), 5 5th level PCs were in the party, one cleric. We had 4 people get drained, 1 of them lost 6 strength, 2 lost 3 strength, the final lost 5 strength. Our cleric had one lesser restoration and healed 4 str from the 6.

Which meant our party was still down -2 on one guy, -3 on two people, and -5 on another, from a battle with 4 shadows. We are in a dungeon without much time to rest. We've had 2 days go by so far, and that one fight is still draining a good deal of our strength. Our cleric had to ditch one third of his spells to restore our strength one day, which made him much weaker too. Anything that can mess up a party for several days is a bit powerful in my mind.

Better to make ability drain come back much faster, but failing that, give an ability to protect against it to everyone without some special ability.

Wizards get some protections against this sort of damage, as well as the ability to better compensate for drained abilities (memorizing bull's strength if their strength gets drained).

Clerics can remove the effects entirely, or prevent them entirely, so they're fine.

Rogues and fighters really get messed up by these abilities, over an extended period of time. I think two saves might be over doing it a bit, but I far prefer this system overall.

 

[Dr. Zoom]

Re: Re: [3.5e] New rules from Savage Species

According to the current rules, you get a save to remove negative levels. How is it any different in Savage Species?

Yes, but the thread is about the revised rules coming in July, commonly called D&D 3.5e. Savage Species has some of those revisions already. Energy Drain is apparently one of those changes.

 

[shilsen]

Honestly, good riddens to ability drain and level drain without some chance of avoidance. Average fighter, despite some great combat related abilities, has a very limited way of removing preventing any drain, and it takes days to get the full potential back. If ability drain healed faster it wouldn't be so bad, but that isn't always an option.

Best example of this was one fight against Shadows (theoretically, I don't remember the actual specifics), 5 5th level PCs were in the party, one cleric. We had 4 people get drained, 1 of them lost 6 strength, 2 lost 3 strength, the final lost 5 strength. Our cleric had one lesser restoration and healed 4 str from the 6.

Which meant our party was still down -2 on one guy, -3 on two people, and -5 on another, from a battle with 4 shadows. We are in a dungeon without much time to rest. We've had 2 days go by so far, and that one fight is still draining a good deal of our strength. Our cleric had to ditch one third of his spells to restore our strength one day, which made him much weaker too. Anything that can mess up a party for several days is a bit powerful in my mind.

Better to make ability drain come back much faster, but failing that, give an ability to protect against it to everyone without some special ability.

Wizards get some protections against this sort of damage, as well as the ability to better compensate for drained abilities (memorizing bull's strength if their strength gets drained).

Clerics can remove the effects entirely, or prevent them entirely, so they're fine.

Rogues and fighters really get messed up by these abilities, over an extended period of time. I think two saves might be over doing it a bit, but I far prefer this system overall.

Sorry to disappoint you Janos, but the above situation won't change. The new rule of two saves applies to the energy drain ability. Shadows do temporary Str damage, which is completely different, and according to SS, there's no change where that's concerned.