3 Very Different Campaigns

[takasi]

I posted this in another thread as a response to dealth penalty fears. I was wondering if I could get specific feedback, so I decided to post here separately. I am currently in three campaigns that have been running since October. Which style would you prefer if you could only join one campaign and why?


1.) 10 player linear monthly marathon game session. (I DM)

Character creation: 32 point buy for core only, 28 point buy for core starting with expansion slots (non core options) at odd levels, 25 point buy for 3 expansion slots (non core options) at starting level and an addition slot at odd levels, non-elite array for +1 LA (same expansion rules as 25 point buy), standard array for +2 LA (same expansion rules as 25 point buy).

Death Penalty: TPK or bust. When you get to -10 you take a "time out" until the battle is over. You cannot be healed until all nearby enemies are dead. People are still very pissed when they die, especially at the beginning of battle.

Replacement: If a TPK occurs the session ends and everyone must make new characters for the next monthly session. You cannot choose the same class or race. Characters start off at the same level but with half of their expected character wealth.

Loot: If a TPK occurs all loot is lost.

Switching characters: You can retire your old character at any time, but you must play through at least one of the monthly sessions 2 levels lower than the party level. (Each session players go through 2 levels of play.) You cannot play your retired characters.


2.) 7 player semi-linear weekly game session. (I play)

Character creation: 32 point buy for core only, 28 point buy for 1 expansion slot (non core options) at starting level and an additional slot at odd levels, 25 point buy for 3 expansion slots (non core options) at starting level and an addition slot at odd levels.

Death Penalty: All characters (not companions, familiars, cohorts, etc) have action points per the Eberron/UA rules. You can spend 2 action points to prevent your character from dying (similar to WFRPG fate points).

Replacement: Players start their new characters one level lower than their previous party level.

Loot: Gear that is recovered is given to the next party member, who can sell the gear to use as a replacement.

Switching characters: You may not switch characters in this campaign.


3.) 5 player non-linear weekly game session. (I DM)

Character creation: 3d6 down the line (option 7). Starting wealth and hit points are rolled randomly. Core rules only to start, but if a character survives to odd certain levels he can earn expansion slots for non-core options when building new characters.

Death Penalty: -10 = dead. Also, you do not confirm critical hits. We use the good hits and bad misses from Dragon. At least one character dies in every session.

Replacement: Players must start their characters at level 1 with standard equipment (starting gp is rolled) regardless of the level and wealth of the rest of the party.

Loot: Gear that is recovered is considered party treasure to be sold and split evenly.

Switching characters: Your PC can become an NPC at any time, but cannot accompany the party on quests. Replacement character are created at 1st level. You can use your old PCs at any time.

You can find more info about all of our campaigns here:

http://www.rpgyubasutter.com/

 

[Deuce Traveler]

I noticed one of your campaign monks is a warforged that does more than 6d8 points of damage per strike. With 5 attacks, that would be more than 30d8 points of damage a round. How does that happen?

 

[takasi]

He had battlefist, monk's belt and one other thing (can't recall at the moment) that upped his base unarmed strike damage.

That is our retired campaign (started 6/05 ended 9/06). Here were the rules for that one:

4.) 7 player semi-linear weekly game session. (I DM)

Character creation: 32 point buy. All WotC material is available.

Death Penalty: All characters (not companions, familiars, cohorts, etc) have action points per the Eberron/UA rules. You can spend 2 action points to prevent your character from dying (similar to WFRPG fate points).

Replacement: Players start their new characters one level lower than their previous party level.

Loot: Gear that is recovered is given to the next party member, who can sell the gear to use as a replacement.

Switching characters: You may not switch characters in this campaign.

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

Your character creation rules for all campaigns seem pretty ridiculous to me.

 

[takasi]

Your character creation rules for all campaigns seem pretty ridiculous to me.

How so?

For the first two campaigns the expansion system is based on the RPGA (a little more strict with expansions every other level rather than every level). The third campaign is intentionally ridiculous. The fourth (retired) campaign was your basic 32 point buy; nothing out of the ordinary there.

 

[wildstarsreach]

Your character creation rules for all campaigns seem pretty ridiculous to me.

Please elaborate on the opinion. I play in these games and would like to understand why someone would think that they are rediculas.

 

[Drawmack]

I don't think I'd enjoy playing an any of those games. I've been playing for 17 years and only witnessed PC death (except in 1 off games) about a dozen times in all those years. It seems that players die to often in your games for them to even be anywhere near heroic.

 

[Patryn of Elvenshae]

Sorry - I should have been more specific.

1. They're ridiculously complicated. They require either: 1) that the DM trusts his players when they say they've used Character Creation Method X, or 2) that the DM personally vets each new character to ensure compliance. If the DM actually trusts his players, then why doesn't he trust them enough to create balanced characters using all available splat-books?

2. They do not favor all classes equally. As mentioned in another thread on a similar topic, it was pointed out that a "properly chosen" Core + 1 cleric is going to be lightyears ahead of, say, a "properly chosen" Core + 3 fighter. Combine that with the fighter having fewer "character build points" (sacrificed to open up those +3 books), and there's an even greater disparity in power.

3. They are not balanced across all "archetypes." Take, for instance, someone who wants to run a straight brute barbarian. He really doesn't need much more than what is present in the PHB and, maybe, one extra book for fun. Contrast this, however, with someone who wants to run a light fighter: good, solid, balanced feats for this style have appeared in three separate books. Either he closes himself off to one or more of these options and tries to make a sub-supported archetype work, or he suffers the reduction in build points.

4. They make no correction for scale. A cleric who chooses, for instance, the Spell Compendium as his +1 source (and gains access to potentially hundreds of spells) pays the same price as someone who wants exactly 1 feat from a non-PHB book and otherwise is a pure Core character.

Does that help to explain my position?

EDIT: And Campaign 4 wasn't posted yet when I started on my response to the first three; you can assume that my comments don't apply to that campaign.

 

[Mauricio Pezzotta]

3, because I find everything else in the others ridiculous.

 

[takasi]

Thank you for the feedback.

1. They're ridiculously complicated. They require either: 1) that the DM trusts his players when they say they've used Character Creation Method X, or 2) that the DM personally vets each new character to ensure compliance. If the DM actually trusts his players, then why doesn't he trust them enough to create balanced characters using all available splat-books?

In all campaigns we post our characters in stat block format so the DM can review them. We go over them with a fine tooth comb. In fact, part of the fun of the game, for us, is reviewing and discussing character builds.

As far as complicated, this method actually makes it much easier to understand what's going on in a sheet. The first thing I usually check is the expansion list.

2. They do not favor all classes equally. As mentioned in another thread on a similar topic, it was pointed out that a "properly chosen" Core + 1 cleric is going to be lightyears ahead of, say, a "properly chosen" Core + 3 fighter. Combine that with the fighter having fewer "character build points" (sacrificed to open up those +3 books), and there's an even greater disparity in power.

That all depends on what's selected and what's allowed in the campaign. There are certain restrictions on a couple of spells, feats and prestige classes.

Even more importantly though is that you aren't paying for power, you're paying to play something exotic. Some feel core is too boring but it can be a pain for the DM to keep track of sheets with builds from dozens of sourcebooks. The higher number of players in the game the more difficult it is for the DM to understand all of the powers of each individual character.

3. They are not balanced across all "archetypes." Take, for instance, someone who wants to run a straight brute barbarian. He really doesn't need much more than what is present in the PHB and, maybe, one extra book for fun. Contrast this, however, with someone who wants to run a light fighter: good, solid, balanced feats for this style have appeared in three separate books. Either he closes himself off to one or more of these options and tries to make a sub-supported archetype work, or he suffers the reduction in build points.

In practice a reduction in build points does not imbalance the game. In fact, it's almost identical to the variation you would get if players rolled dice. Again, you're not buying power; you're buying options (and the DM's attention).

4. They make no correction for scale. A cleric who chooses, for instance, the Spell Compendium as his +1 source (and gains access to potentially hundreds of spells) pays the same price as someone who wants exactly 1 feat from a non-PHB book and otherwise is a pure Core character.

You do not purchase books, you purchase individual options from within books. You must pay for each feat, spell, magic item, class, race, variant, etc. Basically if it's on your sheet and it's not from the core books you must pay for it. You would get one spell from the SC, not the entire book.

Does that help to explain my position?

Yes, thank you.