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<blockquote data-quote="Jeff Wilder" data-source="post: 4851034" data-attributes="member: 5122">In other words, &quot;Don't go by representation of the minis and environment.&nbsp; Always go to the grid.&quot;And that's the thing: as much as reasonably possible, I'd like to be able to ignore the grid.&nbsp; What I like about minis and battlemats (and pretty maps, etc) is that they provide a representation of relative locations and distances.In 4E, they no longer do (in too many cases).&nbsp; And that really bugs me.You can easily do it for yourself.&nbsp; On a sheet of graph paper, draw two 4E 5x5 rooms, one on the straights, one on the diagonals.Now do the same thing using 1-2-1 measurement.The difference is dramatic.Yes, you'd think.&nbsp; But in 4E, a 5x5 room drawn on the diagonals contains twice as many squares as a 5x5 room drawn on the straights.This has all kinds of weird implications under the 4E rules.&nbsp; Using Perception to search a full room, for instance, takes much longer if the room you're searching is drawn on the diagonals.Can you handwave this weirdness?&nbsp; Of course.&nbsp; Should you?&nbsp; Probably.But it bugs me.&nbsp; Everytime something like this happens in 4E, I stop thinking about my character searching a room and start thinking about the weirdness of 4E's geometry.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Jeff Wilder, post: 4851034, member: 5122"] In other words, "Don't go by representation of the minis and environment. Always go to the grid." And that's the thing: as much as reasonably possible, I'd like to be able to ignore the grid. What I like about minis and battlemats (and pretty maps, etc) is that they provide a representation of relative locations and distances. In 4E, they no longer do (in too many cases). And that really bugs me. You can easily do it for yourself. On a sheet of graph paper, draw two 4E 5x5 rooms, one on the straights, one on the diagonals. Now do the same thing using 1-2-1 measurement. The difference is dramatic. Yes, you'd think. But in 4E, a 5x5 room drawn on the diagonals contains twice as many squares as a 5x5 room drawn on the straights. This has all kinds of weird implications under the 4E rules. Using Perception to search a full room, for instance, takes much longer if the room you're searching is drawn on the diagonals. Can you handwave this weirdness? Of course. Should you? Probably. But it bugs me. Everytime something like this happens in 4E, I stop thinking about my character searching a room and start thinking about the weirdness of 4E's geometry. [/QUOTE]

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