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4e design in 5.5e ?
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<blockquote data-quote="EzekielRaiden" data-source="post: 8412100" data-attributes="member: 6790260"><p>I mean, I did literally go into the exact reasons for that, in a post that was generally well-received by most people, even those I often disagree with. Instead of just dismissing the argument out of hand, you <em>could</em> dig deeper and ask how and why someone could come to that conclusion, given that there <em>are</em> similarities between these mechanics.</p><p></p><p></p><p>That's fair, though a big part of the problem is simply the randomness. Being at the mercy of the dice as to whether you get your class fantasy is pretty disappointing in modern game design. In old-school games, "class fantasy" was handled dramatically differently (a mixture of behind-the-scenes elements and only having a small number of classes to begin with). Modern games with an old-school lean, such as Dungeon World, tend to do this by making strongly-thematic fundamental moves that are expected to show up a lot, e.g. the Fighter's <em>Bend Bars, Lift Gates</em> move or the Paladin's <em>I Am The Law</em> move. IOW: While your idea is sound in the context of proper old-school gaming (as in, not <em>inspired by</em>, but rather the real deal or emulating it as close as possible), in practice with today's games and gamers it probably wouldn't be received well.</p><p></p><p>To use a highly simplified analogy: Imagine if you had to roll a die just to find out if you were <em>allowed</em> to make attack rolls this turn, or carry heavy equipment this adventure, or whatever else. Whether or not it feels connected back to the fiction, having your "special thing" be gated behind the whims of the dice does not, in general, feel super engaging for a lot of folks today.</p><p></p><p></p><p>In theory, this was supposed to be alleviated by replacing your Encounter powers every few levels, but yes, I grant that. I <em>massively</em> prefer the 13th Age solution though. It's significantly more user-friendly game design to <em>create incentive</em> to hold onto your strong tools, rather than to <em>not let you have</em> those tools. (Particularly when other and far less potent tools are also shackled to those limits, like Expertise Dice or Ki points.)</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="EzekielRaiden, post: 8412100, member: 6790260"] I mean, I did literally go into the exact reasons for that, in a post that was generally well-received by most people, even those I often disagree with. Instead of just dismissing the argument out of hand, you [I]could[/I] dig deeper and ask how and why someone could come to that conclusion, given that there [I]are[/I] similarities between these mechanics. That's fair, though a big part of the problem is simply the randomness. Being at the mercy of the dice as to whether you get your class fantasy is pretty disappointing in modern game design. In old-school games, "class fantasy" was handled dramatically differently (a mixture of behind-the-scenes elements and only having a small number of classes to begin with). Modern games with an old-school lean, such as Dungeon World, tend to do this by making strongly-thematic fundamental moves that are expected to show up a lot, e.g. the Fighter's [I]Bend Bars, Lift Gates[/I] move or the Paladin's [I]I Am The Law[/I] move. IOW: While your idea is sound in the context of proper old-school gaming (as in, not [I]inspired by[/I], but rather the real deal or emulating it as close as possible), in practice with today's games and gamers it probably wouldn't be received well. To use a highly simplified analogy: Imagine if you had to roll a die just to find out if you were [I]allowed[/I] to make attack rolls this turn, or carry heavy equipment this adventure, or whatever else. Whether or not it feels connected back to the fiction, having your "special thing" be gated behind the whims of the dice does not, in general, feel super engaging for a lot of folks today. In theory, this was supposed to be alleviated by replacing your Encounter powers every few levels, but yes, I grant that. I [I]massively[/I] prefer the 13th Age solution though. It's significantly more user-friendly game design to [I]create incentive[/I] to hold onto your strong tools, rather than to [I]not let you have[/I] those tools. (Particularly when other and far less potent tools are also shackled to those limits, like Expertise Dice or Ki points.) [/QUOTE]
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