Upgrade your account to a Community Supporter account and remove most of the site ads.

Reply to thread

Message: <blockquote data-quote="TwinBahamut" data-source="post: 3795654" data-attributes="member: 32536">Maybe I am jumping into this thread a little late, but...I really like the new idea behind Demons and Devils. It works well. Someone else in this thread phrased it well when he said that instead of just arbitrarily dividing based on alignment, and trying to explain it from there, now they are being divided based on actual role. In other words, the designers are designing things based on how fun it is for the players and DMs, rather than trying to achieve some kind of ideal symmetry in the D&D cosmos. In 4E, some random magical apocalypse (or maybe just a really well organized group of PCs) can come by and completely wipe out the Nine Hells or the Abyss, and the world will be better of for it, rather than it triggering some kind of absolute setting implosion.Regardless, I am more interested in these planar set-ups, the Astral Sea and the Elemental Tempest. Both sound like the elegant fusion of Transitive Planes and the general concepts of the Inner and Outer Planes. The name Astral Sea implies a certain ability to sail across it, with different realms acting as islands, rather than different realities. I like that. And the Elemental Tempest seems to be fusing all the elemental planes with Limbo, essentially recreating the realm of Chaos from Milton's Paradise Lost. In Milton's work, Chaos is the realm of churning elements from which all physical matter is derived, and Heaven, Hell, and the Earth all exist as islands within it. It is a much more interesting concept then seperate and nearly featureless pure elemental planes. And certainly, "Elemental Tempest" is a better name for such a place than "Limbo" ever was. Who on Earth thought it was a good idea to name the realm of chaos, where nothing is stable, with a word which is often used to mean "stasis"?Anyway, I think these hints of the new cosmology bode well.And to clear up a point from much earlier in the thread... Yes, Greek/Roman mythology is a clear case of modern gods fighting primordial gods. Jupiter never fought against the primordial Uranus, but only because his father Saturn beat him to it. A father was defeated by his son, who was in turn defeated by his son. Oh, and in Norse myth, the entire human world was created from the dead body of a primordial frost giant that was slain by Odin and his brothers. And then there is Horus, who fights his uncle Set after his father Osiris is slain. There is plenty of precedent for generation conflict in mythology.Also, I really think people need to remember that we don't even know if Demons are CE and Devils are LE, or even if CE and LE exist. We do know that something has changed in the definition of chaotic.</blockquote>

Verification