D&D 4E 4e game suggestion request

[stoloc]

I have been thinking of running a game using many ideas from 4th edition as a basic template.

However for me I do not like the 4th edition magic items/treasure rules and have been trying to think of alternatives which are similar to that of a fairly low magic 1st edition campaign.

The basic rules of 4th edition assume a certain level of magic which I would maintain using ideas from the 4th Ed DMG2. As an example of what I am planning - you would not obtain a vicious weapon +3 at lvl 12 but would
instead train with a master warrior who knows how to hit especially telling blows. This would be used for most weapons, armor and neck slot items. However there would still be a place for truly enchanted items on a case by
case basis (Holy avengers being one example that comes to mind although these may be spontaneously created by the gods for an especially devout paladin for example).

On the other hand I would also like to include hi-quality armors such as Drow-mesh, Godplate etc as well as hi-quality crafted weapons of similar manufacture which can only be created by exceptional smiths, weavers etc based on item type.

My question is, how expensive should the higher levels of armor/weapons be?

Any other ideas/thoughts regarding this would be most appreciated. (if this is not an apprpriate venue for this question I will be happy to remove it as I am not interested in flaming edition wars)

 

[Scribble]

My question is, how expensive should the higher levels of armor/weapons be?

What exactly will they do in regard to the rules?

Do they function as essentially as a +X item?

If so, price them around what it says in the books adjust as you see fit up or down depending on how much you want to encourage or discourage buying and selling of the items.

If not... well it depends on what they do, and as above how much you want to encourage/discourage buying/selling of them.

My next campaign I'm planning on doing something similar, with "true" magic items in the world all being basically artifacts.

I'm also thinking of only using martial (and a few other) power sources. Rituals would be the main source of magic in the world.

 

[stoloc]

I intend to do different things for different items- Drow-mesh armor would be similar to the effect of hi quality drow mesh already in 4th edition but would not be "magical" per se but would have a bonus to ac and possibly reflex over regular armor.

As for hi quality weapons this I am still thinking about how I want to do it and I am looking for ideas. Perhaps it would give a small bonus to hit or damage based on being crafted for a specific user or against a specific type of creature.

 

[Sepp]

I think the DMG2 section on inherent bonuses might help you. Unfortunately, I am away from my books and can't give you a page number.

 

[Ktulu]

I would advise using the alternative "inherent" bonus system. Players get bonuses to attack, damage, AC, and defenses throughout the game at specific levels. As such, you don't need magic items.

Then, when players reach the +bonus equal to the requirement of a special quality armor, they can purchase it as a regular suit of armor. It's restricted by when they can level, but it makes it easy, especially if you're not using the regular treasure rules, which could impact their overall income.

if you use the Character Builder, the characters can be set with this by checking the "inherent bonuses" box.

 

[cdrcjsn]

Your idea of training to get special weapon qualities (i.e. Vicious) is an interesting one, but you have to be careful to put limitations on that.

A character that is able to train into several different weapon properties would be very unbalanced because they would essentially have weapons that are much higher in terms of actual level than what they should be able to afford.

A way to get around that would be to call them different weapon techniques that are incompatible so they'll need to choose which one to use at any given moment.

Also, using a particular technique would need to be limited to a particular attack bonus, otherwise, they can train all weapon techniques at low level and have access to high level attacks. You can just have them pay for the training equal to the difference in weapon levels to access the technique at higher attack bonuses (or they can use them at the lower bonus).

 

[stoloc]

Your idea of training to get special weapon qualities (i.e. Vicious) is an interesting one, but you have to be careful to put limitations on that.

A character that is able to train into several different weapon properties would be very unbalanced because they would essentially have weapons that are much higher in terms of actual level than what they should be able to afford.

A way to get around that would be to call them different weapon techniques that are incompatible so they'll need to choose which one to use at any given moment.

Also, using a particular technique would need to be limited to a particular attack bonus, otherwise, they can train all weapon techniques at low level and have access to high level attacks. You can just have them pay for the training equal to the difference in weapon levels to access the technique at higher attack bonuses (or they can use them at the lower bonus).

The weapon techniques idea would be limited only 1 technique at a time as it would take significant practice time/focus to obtain one and stay up to date as it were and you would only be eligible to learn them at appropriate levels.

Doing this with weapons seems fairly simple to me conceptually anyway.
My main question is with the cost related to masterwork type armors
How much SHOULD unenchanted Drowmesh chain cost?

 

[Mentat55]

The DMG2 has a lot of info that might be very relevant to your game, particularly the section on Alternative Rewards (p. 136-145). This section includes the inherent bonus rules (in the "A Reward-Based Game" box, p. 138) and things like divine boons and and grandmaster training, which effectively grant magic item-like powers.

For masterwork armor, p. 138 suggests that a suit of masterwork armor cost as much as a basic suit of magic armor equal to the minimum enhancement bonus of the MW armor. E.g., drowmesh armor is minimum +3, right? So it would cost 9,000 gp (the cost of magic armor +3).

If you are going to rework monetary wealth, then you'll have to adjust this cost accordingly.