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Community
General Tabletop Discussion
D&D Older Editions
4E suggestion - remove save or die in favour of two types of hitpoints
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<blockquote data-quote="Gort" data-source="post: 3730626" data-attributes="member: 11239"><p>Not sure if this has been suggested, but I really hate save-or-die spells as they are in 3.5 ed. It's really anticlimactic when a player or big monster gets zapped dead in the first round just because of a single dice roll. It always feels better to me when the fight lasts a few rounds, the baddie and the players get to use their cool abilities, and finally the victor emerges triumphant. Save-or-die spells just remove the fight, pretty much. And it's not just the save-or-die spells that are the problem, there are plenty of spells that are save-or-you're-screwed, like tashas hideous laughter, or even hold person - it's not like any baddie lasts long once they're unable to act.</p><p></p><p>So, with that established, I'd like to put forward a suggestion for fixing the situation - give everyone two sets of hitpoints - physical and mental. Base them on constitution and wisdom. Then you have spell that affect you physically like destruction do damage - large amounts, but not just save-or-die, and not resisted by a save. Likewise for spells that affect you mentally, such as hold person. They will have to wear through your mental hitpoints before they can affect you. When either set of hitpoints is exhausted, the spell affects you as though you'd failed a save in the original version. So a flesh-to-stone spell would do physical damage to you as it turns bits of you to stone, but it would only actually turn you to stone once you hit 0 hitpoints. Likewise a domination spell would do mental damage until you hit 0, at which point the caster will have destroyed your will and you're at his mercy.</p><p></p><p>Any thoughts? Even if you don't like my suggestion, I think we can all agree that save-or-die has gotta go, but that spells like flesh-to-stone and disintegrate are pretty cool, so they need to stay.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Gort, post: 3730626, member: 11239"] Not sure if this has been suggested, but I really hate save-or-die spells as they are in 3.5 ed. It's really anticlimactic when a player or big monster gets zapped dead in the first round just because of a single dice roll. It always feels better to me when the fight lasts a few rounds, the baddie and the players get to use their cool abilities, and finally the victor emerges triumphant. Save-or-die spells just remove the fight, pretty much. And it's not just the save-or-die spells that are the problem, there are plenty of spells that are save-or-you're-screwed, like tashas hideous laughter, or even hold person - it's not like any baddie lasts long once they're unable to act. So, with that established, I'd like to put forward a suggestion for fixing the situation - give everyone two sets of hitpoints - physical and mental. Base them on constitution and wisdom. Then you have spell that affect you physically like destruction do damage - large amounts, but not just save-or-die, and not resisted by a save. Likewise for spells that affect you mentally, such as hold person. They will have to wear through your mental hitpoints before they can affect you. When either set of hitpoints is exhausted, the spell affects you as though you'd failed a save in the original version. So a flesh-to-stone spell would do physical damage to you as it turns bits of you to stone, but it would only actually turn you to stone once you hit 0 hitpoints. Likewise a domination spell would do mental damage until you hit 0, at which point the caster will have destroyed your will and you're at his mercy. Any thoughts? Even if you don't like my suggestion, I think we can all agree that save-or-die has gotta go, but that spells like flesh-to-stone and disintegrate are pretty cool, so they need to stay. [/QUOTE]
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4E suggestion - remove save or die in favour of two types of hitpoints
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