4th ED adaptations for my world setting

[SkidAce]

Long time lurker...first time thread poster..

1. I have had a Runemaster class in my campaign every since 1st edition. I adapted some spells from a 3rd party supplement called the Arcanum that had a lot of area effect spells that were cast by drawing symbols in mid air.

Over the editions I have adopted changes and modified the class to fit better and better. I stole the Runecaster class from the Forgotten Realms and made it an arcane class. I even stole the Runemaster from the Gazetteer from Glantri (that was one of the best ones for a long time)

I am havng trouble replicating what I want in 4th edition. The class should use symbols drawn in air, and Power word type utterances. I thought about re-flavoring the artificer, but being a leader class doesnt feel quite right. (though there were symbols of healing for this class in the past). It feels like a wizard (lots of study, research the true name/symbol of things)

So..do I try to create a build like the illusionist or summoner? I don't want a paragon path, My runemasters are normally runemasters from the start. (They would use the staff implement of course)

which leads to b.

b. In the past...normal wizards would run into/encouter/study with Runemaster NPCs and pick up some of their knowledge. Obviously they can pick up any specialized rituals...but how would they get special abilities or at wills (assuming the runmaster had a unique at will) I have read re-training...but it seems limiting...how are my normal wizards going to learn the Awesome rune of death spell/power after defeating/studying with the Runemaster?

I am perplexed.

Thanks for any assistance..will check in when I can...military keeps me busy.

 

[Nifft]

I suspect you could get what you want by writing some new Wizard spells. Runemaster would be a kind of Wizard, just as Summoner and Illusionist are "just" Wizards who happen to know a lot of summoning and/or illusion spells. (Of course, you'll want some kind of class feature to reward choosing lots of Runic spells...)

This also allows cross-pollination with "regular" Wizards.

Cheers, -- N

 

[drothgery]

I think you might want to look at reflavoring the Invoker (replace Channel Divinity with something else, reflavor the heavily Divine-flavored powers), rather than the Wizard. If you start there, you've already got a bunch of Glyph, Icon, Ward, and Seal powers which seem to have the right flavor.

 

[SkidAce]

Hmmm, let me consider both of these ideas.

If I wrote new spells for a wizard build Nifft, how would the players add them to their list?

Maybe I could steal the invoker powers...

 

[Asmor]

They'd just pick them... Spells are just powers.

You haven't really made much of a case for why Runemasters couldn't just be wizards who happen to cast their spells by drawing glyphs in the air. I think you're making things much more complicated than they need to be.

 

[Nifft]

If I wrote new spells for a wizard build Nifft, how would the players add them to their list?

Like others said, spells are just powers, and you know a limited number of powers. Just don't make your additions more powerful than what's out there right now, and the class will stay (roughly) balanced.

Here's a tip: look at the Invoker powers, and then make a version which is inferior in some regard (e.g. deals less damage). Now add a line that Runic Wizards get back whatever you took away. Ta-dah! Regular Wizards don't get to steal nice things from the Invoker, but Runic Wizards can -- though they pay for it by not getting nice Wizardly things, like no Staff of Defense or Wand of Accuracy.

Cheers, -- N

 

[SkidAce]

It's possible I am missing something blatently obvious, just transitioned to 4th.

However consider a wizard in previous editions, who finds the "Rune of Ultimate Pain", say a 3rd level spell. He adds it to his book after meeting whatever requirements the rules and DM impose, and tada...he can use it.

Can the wizard do that in 4th without re-training one of his powers? Just learn a new power and start using it?

I realize they could pick them when gaining additinal powers or retraining...but I guess thats why I broke my question into a. and b. Like you say, I am leaning towards them being wizards that draw glyphs in the air (invoker does have some cool spells though).
But then it occured to me...can wizards learn defeated foes powers? Or just the rituals? Actually now that I think about it...can they learn utility powers from kindly mentors or found books?

What I have read so far leads me to believe the only time they could choose the "new stuff" is when leveling or re-training.

Good inputs...I amy be making it complicated...in the past I usually gave any new class a twist to set it apart. It just feels right to have something mechanically different, such as the illusionist and summoner builds do.

I will post whatever I come up with to get y'alls inputs. Normally I let my players pick it apart..but the Air Force sent me away from all my players.

Thanks

 

[Nifft]

Can the wizard do that in 4th without re-training one of his powers? Just learn a new power and start using it?

Nope.

Rituals: yes. Powers: no.

Powers are what you use in combat.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Inyssius]

Nope.

Yes, actually! Tomes (another kind of wizard implement, like staves or orbs, that debuted in Arcane Power) usually come with two thematically appropriate wizard powers that you can prepare (spellbook style) as long as you have that tome. Creating more of these would not be difficult.

Second: the "runemaster". You could do that as a wizard. Or an invoker. Or an artificer. Or even a bard. It's not difficult, but you will have to rename your powers. Get over it.

 

[SkidAce]

Renaming the powers seems to be the general theme, and I am not adverse to that, changing the fluff I learned in Champions.

drothgery, thanks again for mentioning the invoker, while I think I will probably stay with the wizard, after reading all the invoker powers there is a LOT of the flavor I am looking for.

Now to determine a build benefit.