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<blockquote data-quote="Rhuarc" data-source="post: 5564650" data-attributes="member: 15872">Well, maybe I should have read-up on the Forsaken once more before making the comment, forgot they should be treated as demigods. But maybe it really lies with the designed mechanics of such epic monsters. For the ususal combat encounters with a group of PCs the stat blocks are fine (at least for standard and most of the elite monsters), but for the overall threat level (storywise) they miss abilities that were present in 3.5. Epic spells or powers which emulate them would go a long way in making such creatures a more dire threat, as they should be in the epic tier.Maybe it's just me, but I have a quite hard time coming up with many cool adventure ideas for Immortal characters off the top of my head without having more details about the potential setting. I mean once you are as powerful as gods there aren't many other routes to take than going &quot;cosmic&quot; (meaning threats that are not from the standard camaign world or the standard planes), right? You have to create new planes/dimensions and define how cosmic beings fit in the overall scheme of things.I guess, at least at the moment, I'd rather explore a bit more of the basic multiverse and having many sources of inspiration ready to come up with challenges than taking the next step. Guess that's a big reason why I'd design another tier in between.But you have a different view point, having thought about the expansion of the multiverse for many years (and having touched the subject a bit in the IH), so I think it comes easier to you.By the way, it would be great if you could respond to post #714 as well, pretty sure you overlooked it as I made a double post <img src="https://cdn.jsdelivr.net/joypixels/assets/8.0/png/unicode/64/1f642.png" class="smilie smilie--emoji" loading="lazy" width="64" height="64" alt=":)" title="Smile&nbsp; &nbsp; :)"&nbsp; data-smilie="1"data-shortname=":)" />Thanks!</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Rhuarc, post: 5564650, member: 15872"] Well, maybe I should have read-up on the Forsaken once more before making the comment, forgot they should be treated as demigods. But maybe it really lies with the designed mechanics of such epic monsters. For the ususal combat encounters with a group of PCs the stat blocks are fine (at least for standard and most of the elite monsters), but for the overall threat level (storywise) they miss abilities that were present in 3.5. Epic spells or powers which emulate them would go a long way in making such creatures a more dire threat, as they should be in the epic tier. Maybe it's just me, but I have a quite hard time coming up with many cool adventure ideas for Immortal characters off the top of my head without having more details about the potential setting. I mean once you are as powerful as gods there aren't many other routes to take than going "cosmic" (meaning threats that are not from the standard camaign world or the standard planes), right? You have to create new planes/dimensions and define how cosmic beings fit in the overall scheme of things. I guess, at least at the moment, I'd rather explore a bit more of the basic multiverse and having many sources of inspiration ready to come up with challenges than taking the next step. Guess that's a big reason why I'd design another tier in between. But you have a different view point, having thought about the expansion of the multiverse for many years (and having touched the subject a bit in the IH), so I think it comes easier to you. By the way, it would be great if you could respond to post #714 as well, pretty sure you overlooked it as I made a double post :) Thanks! [/QUOTE]

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