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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Greg Benage" data-source="post: 6793100" data-attributes="member: 93631">Grumpy grognardic, possibly incoherent rant incoming...After a year and a half, for my preferences, I'm beginning to think the game rules are too complex and too boring (<-- see "for my preferences" back over there). Compared to editions I came up with, the PCs are buffed to 11 and the monsters are nerfed. Encounters often feel like, "Roll initiative and then apply your character build to whatever page of the Monster Manual we're on." We can play "theater of the mind" just fine, because ranged attackers always have a feat to take care of range and cover. Who cares where anything is? None of it matters. Are you in melee or not? That's all that matters. Wait...with Crossbow Expert, even that doesn't matter. When it's your turn in the initiative order, apply your character sheet. Then it's the next guy's turn.For me, I increasingly feel like the emphasis has shifted from skilled play to character optimization. I increasingly despise feats. In practice, with the feats players actually choose, they don't enrich or expand a character concept -- they simply apply a specialized mechanical benefit. You take Polearm Master not so that you can use a polearm, but so you become twice as effective with a polearm as any other weapon. Actually, the Weapon Master feat that actually could expand a character concept...LOL at the idea of anyone ever taking it! So much for the days when fighters were weapon masters who could always use the right tool for the job, based on player skill and the tactical situation in actual play. "Uh, I've got Great Weapon Fighting Style, Great Weapon Master, and Polearm Master. What the f--- am I going to do with sword-and-shield or a bow? There's a flying creature? Someone better cast fly on me otherwise the DM is 'punishing' my build."So yeah, it can get boring. Everyone is hyperspecialized, the monsters no longer have any game-changing abilities to fear, so exploration, recon, information-gathering, dungeon diplomacy and all the rest of it are simply replaced by everyone taking turns executing their specialized mechanical operations.I'm playing a fighter in a B/X game. I have Str 16 and Dex 13. I carry a spear and use it from the second rank or throw when I engage, then go sword-and-board. I do 1d6+2 with the spear, 1d8+2 with the sword, and 1d6 with the bow (and that's only because we're using the optional variable weapon damage rules). Wizards are powerful, but they need me to keep them alive. Hit points are low and you're dead if they touch 0. Save-or-die effects abound. Tactics matter. Morale matters. Knowing what you're getting into before initiative is rolled matters. The game rules are stupid simple. Kobolds are tough in packs because the DM plays them as intelligent humanoids that use tactics. They don't have a "pack tactics" special ability in their stat block. 5e turns the "tactics" into yet another mechanical operation to execute. Actually, it's really amazing how WotC has made the monsters both more complex and less interesting. Quite an accomplishment!And that's my assessment of the game as a whole. Too complex, too boring -- for me. I get that many, many players really love character building and optimization, and for them executing those mechanical operations is great fun. Some want even more mechanical operations to build, combinate and execute. I've got no problem with that -- people playing games and having fun makes me happy. I, personally, just find that I'm having less fun with 5e, compared to classic editions, and (at least one of the reasons is the opposite of the thread title: Too complex, too boring.</blockquote>

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