5e combat system too simple / boring?

[Dom de Dom]

Some of the guys in my regular 5e group are becoming a bit bored with the simplicity of 5th edition combat. Not having played through 4th (oldschool returning 2e guy) I don't really have much of a point of reference.Do any other people in here share this problem, and have you any examples of house rules or other methods you use to spice up combats which might otherwise me a bit ploddy?

 

[ProphetSword]

What level are they?

After how many moving parts both 4th Edition and Pathfinder had, 5th is a breath of fresh air. A person from 2nd Edition should be right at home.

 

[Celtavian]

It is more boring in terms of tactical play than Pathfinder/3E. You have fewer options that are usually very simple and intuitive. I know a few of my players miss the character customization from Pathfinder/3E. 5E focuses on simple, fast combat that leaves more time for interesting role-playing and story focus. So far the ease of running it is the best part. I do sometimes find the combat boring and the customization options lacking, but not enough to switch back to a different system that isn't as easy to run.

 

[Tony Vargas]

Some of the guys in my regular 5e group are becoming a bit bored with the simplicity of 5th edition combat. Not having played through 4th (oldschool returning 2e guy) I don't really have much of a point of reference.Do any other people in here share this problem,

It's not a problem, but a difference in focus. A complaint about 4e combats was that they took too long, in part, because of addressing complaints about 3.5 (rocket tag! 5mwd! LFQW! CoDzilla!). 5e responded in turn by removing some in-combat options from most classes, most in-combat options from some classes, increasing chances to hit/save DCs, boosting damage, reducing hps, consolidating bonuses and advocating for TotM (which makes it harder to run complex combats, so just run simpler ones). Now combats are faster. Are they boring? No, because they're over so fast - boredom, takes time to set in. If you use the time saved to run more combats, sure, in aggregate they'll maybe get boring, but if you use it for exploration & interaction, that's less likely to happen.

and have you any examples of house rules or other methods you use to spice up combats which might otherwise me a bit ploddy?

Simply putting your combats back on the grid, using modules, or re-cycling earlier edition rules (like C&T, since you're most familiar with 2e) to add in-combat options won't make a huge difference. Standard-issue combats will still be over relatively quickly because of high%, high damage offense vs finite hps, and a larger, more challenging 'tactical' or 'set piece' combat will likely become problematic due to the way being outnumbered plays out under bounded accuracy.

5e is just different from 3e & 4e (and similar to 2e, pre-C&T) that way. The system focus isn't 'interesting' tactical combat, so, instead, make the focus an interesting story, and the combats only little packages of action that break it up and keep it lively. You can add more interest in exploration challenges - traps, puzzles, and the like - and interaction with NPCs.

Now, your players could also choose more interesting characters. A Champion Fighter will get boring faster than a Warlock, who'll pall before a Druid. And, classes that have to work a little at generating DPR (or more cleverly overcoming foes), are also going to be more interesting, and make for more interesting combats, than those that just spew DPR or blow up whole batches of enemies wholesale. The 5e gaming experience is mostly on the DM, but player choices do matter. Flexible characters with more choices to make in play will be less boring than one-trick-ponies, for instance.

 

[NotActuallyTim]

The basic rules for combat are pretty darned simple, and it's true that some people with experience in playing more complex combat systems may get bored quickly.

There's a lot of ways to solve this. You could refocus on things other than combat to get people engaged, by introducing more social opportunities. You can wildcard combat by introducing alternate win conditions (Get out of the room before the floor crumbles away!). You could spend a lot of time inventing new combat rules (I'm actually doing this, but I'm nowhere near finished).

However, if they're super bored because they don't have enough actions and numbers to memorize, I'd suggest you just start improvising actions with your monsters. Then point out that if the players want to start tossing sand into people's eyes all they have to do say "My character throws sand into the Orc's face!"

 

[Dom de Dom]

Yeah I like it personally, although the game I am running they are 4th so still slightly limited, we also have a couple of games each around 11th.

Interesting that you think the simplicity is a winner over the previous complex systems.

Some options for houserules that my friends have suggested include -



Increase effectiveness of dual wielding by granting an extra off hand attack with dual weapon feat.

Drop concentration just to see what happens. Or how about you can concentrate on a number of spells at a time depending on your level

Possible increase of spellslots for all casters.

Give more spells on level up to wizards and anyone with a spellbook, measured by Int score

Armour that's good against certain weapons, bad against others, same for weapons.

Weapon speeds.

House rule on flanking +1 to hit
Charge attack available to all, Action, move half move do one attack but grant advantage or +2 to hit until next turn.

Grant grapple bonuses based on size.

Skill specialisations, one per Int bonus, +1 or 2 to a sub skill eg. Athletics (shove), Arcana (necromancy), Stealth (Moving silently). For each specialisation you have a negative modifier on a different skill.

Hamstring - attack with weapon, hit and slowed, no damage.
Also something called 5 foot steps… which I don’t understand!

 

[Warmaster Horus]

I find there are plenty of options if you have the right players and DM. It's easy to distill combats down to simple DPR but there are lots of ways to make conflict more challenging.

 

[iserith]

I find that it's never the system that's boring - it's the design of the challenges. That's a DM thing rather than a game thing.

As long as the system is elegant enough to resolve uncertainty and otherwise gets the hell out of the way, it is fine in my view.

 

[Kabouter Games]

5e isn't going to give a player who's used to the crunch of other editions/games what she wants. That's one of the joys of 5e - it's SIMPLE. That doesn't mean it has to be boring, though. You can evoke the crunch through words. Roleplay it. The point is to get away from numbers and math and into describing what happens by appealing to the senses.

Boring Way:

Player: I attack the orc. 2 attacks, plus Smite. [rolls] 10 and 23.

DM: 10 misses, 23 hits.

Player: 8, plus 12 from the smite.

DM: It's dead.

Not Boring Way:

Player: I bring my shield on guard, swinging my sword and singing a hymn to the glory of Torm, praying he sees fit to grant me the strength to Smite the foul orc. [rolls die] First attack, ah, crap, that's only a 10. Second attack is 23. I'll put the Smite on that one.

DM: Your first blow strikes the orc's shield. He appears shaken, his defenses slow and clumsy. Your second stroke strikes true, skimming around the edge of his shield to bite into his body. And behold, Torm has heard your prayer and your hymn, finding them pleasing. You feel the power of holy vengeance well up within you. Roll damage.

Player: Um, 8, plus 12 from the Smite.

DM: [having determined that was enough to kill the orc] Your sword bites into the orc's chest, driving deep. Your god's power crackles leaps from your arm, along the blade, and into its body, exploding from the hapless fool's eye sockets as its evil is consumed from within. Black blood streams from its mouth as it collapses, smoking and hissing, at your feet.

See what I mean?

You can do it for spells, too:

Boring way:

Player: I cast Fire Bolt. [rolls] 19.

DM: Hit. Roll damage.

Player: 6.

DM: Okay. Not quite dead. Your turn, Brian.

Not Boring Way:

Player: A spark leaps from my fingertip and streaks toward the goblin as I utter the arcane incantation Fire Bolt. [rolls] 19 to hit.

DM: Your spark explodes into a wreath of fire to envelop the goblin. Roll damage.

Player: 6.

DM: The goblin shrieks in anger and pain. The stench of burned goblin hair and brimstone assaults the Fighter's nostrils as the mystical flames disperse. This is just the opening he needs to move in and attack.

Anyway, you get the drift. It's all flavor text, but it's INTERESTING flavor text. It can be helpful to use the critical tables from Rolemaster to get an idea, especially for describing killing blows. Another method is to write some descriptive phrases on index cards and keep them handy.

 

[Blackwarder]

As a DM, the more streamlined combat rules help me run more elaborate encounters quickly and in an exciting way, be it aerial combat, ambushes or combats with tons of participants.

Maybe the complexity level of each individual isn't that high, but the synergy levels are huge.

Warder