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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Stalker0" data-source="post: 8217999" data-attributes="member: 5889">I guess it always comes down to the expectations at these levels. For example, to me the idea of "new" epic level players is a bit of an oxymoron, I expect people playing at those levels to have been around the block, and so this is a step up in complexity but not a leap. But I respect not everyone feels that way.As for the statblock complexity, we are in agreement that all else being equal...a simpler statblock is better. Having DMed many a high level monster I always appreciate that the less a DM has to remember, the better things are. I like your idea to just put magic in the resistance area as example.That said...the CR 30 wyrm is meant to be the "ultimate boss monster". It is basically the final fight of an 20th level game, and has to be a worthy foe against a party that has reality altering powers at their disposal. Therefore, it has to be able to hold its own against anything and everything the Player's handbook can conjure (and in theory since its a full 10 CR higher...it should do more than hold its own, it should "trounce"). In order to do that well, you have to have a lot of tools in the belt.Its also worth considering that such a monster is probably best used as a solo or with minions (probably with minions, even with all the crazy it can deal, multiple 20th level characters are still insanely scary). That means that this monster holds ALL of the complexity of the encounter, its not a scenario where the DM is having to consult abilities on multiple monsters (which from experience is really taxing on the DM brain). You have some easy minions, and then all of your DM attention is spent on this one creature. So your complexity budget can afford to be a bit higher. If this was a "standard" monster than heck no, way too complicated, but as a monster that I am making the hallmark of the encounter (and possibly even the game), then the extra sweat I think is worth it.I can say that even with all those abilities, running this kind of monster is way easier than running monsters from 3.5 or pathfinder at 15th+ level. Having done both, its no contest.</blockquote>

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