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<blockquote data-quote="CapnZapp" data-source="post: 6987254" data-attributes="member: 12731">Sure. This is also a gameplay mode I detest when playing myself. I fully understand that people aren't having issues with Stealth if they simply don't use the skill rules until the monsters are within 30 ft or 60 ft and it's time for Initiative.But as a player I can't stand the notion that no matter what you do, monsters that doesn't possess any remarkable abilities or any noteworthy skill bonuses, can sneak up so close to you. Especially since your character's skills might beat them all.I far prefer an alternate way of playing where, if four critters do manage to come within charging distance, that if the numbers are examined, it actually makes statistical sense. This thread is therefore meant to explore ways to reconcile what happens around the table with actual numbers and die rolls.For instance, I've gotten the suggestion &quot;only roll for the character(s) in first rank&quot; (or &quot;only the first rank character gets a chance of spotting the threat&quot;). I'm taking this to mean &quot;only involve the characters nearest to the threat&quot;. But I would much rather the game explains exactly how this works. If you stand just behind the first character, do your chances really drop from outstanding to non-existant. And by giving monsters racial bonuses, it gets much easier to swallow a group of them all beating my Perception score. I know individual DMs can (and should fudge), but I don't like it when the rules themselves essentially fudge it.I guess it boils down to me wanting stealth to be simulationist and not narrative.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="CapnZapp, post: 6987254, member: 12731"] Sure. This is also a gameplay mode I detest when playing myself. I fully understand that people aren't having issues with Stealth if they simply don't use the skill rules until the monsters are within 30 ft or 60 ft and it's time for Initiative. But as a player I can't stand the notion that no matter what you do, monsters that doesn't possess any remarkable abilities or any noteworthy skill bonuses, can sneak up so close to you. Especially since your character's skills might beat them all. I far prefer an alternate way of playing where, if four critters do manage to come within charging distance, that if the numbers are examined, it actually makes statistical sense. This thread is therefore meant to explore ways to reconcile what happens around the table with actual numbers and die rolls. For instance, I've gotten the suggestion "only roll for the character(s) in first rank" (or "only the first rank character gets a chance of spotting the threat"). I'm taking this to mean "only involve the characters nearest to the threat". But I would much rather the game explains exactly how this works. If you stand just behind the first character, do your chances really drop from outstanding to non-existant. And by giving monsters racial bonuses, it gets much easier to swallow a group of them all beating my Perception score. I know individual DMs can (and should fudge), but I don't like it when the rules themselves essentially fudge it. I guess it boils down to me wanting stealth to be simulationist and not narrative. [/QUOTE]

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