A couple enchanter questions

[aluzer]

1. Does a Unconscious creature get a will save against Mind-affecting spells like Dominate?

2.Could you use Hypnotism more than once to make a creature fanatical about what you asked it to do?

Hypnotism Enchantment (Compulsion) [Mind-Affecting] Level: Brd 1, Sor/Wiz 1 Components: V, S Casting time: 1 round Range: Close (25 ft. + 5 ft./2 levels) Area: Several living creatures, no two of which may be more than 30 ft. apart Duration: 2d4 rounds (D) Saving Throw: Will negates Spell Resistance: Yes
Your gestures and droning incantation fascinate nearby creatures, causing them to stop and stare blankly at you. In addition, you can use their rapt attention to make your suggestions and requests seem more plausible. Roll 2d4 to see how many total Hit Dice of creatures you affect. Creatures with fewer HD are affected before creatures with more HD. Only creatures that can see or hear you are affected, but they do not need to understand you to be fascinated.
If you use this spell in combat, each target gains a +2 bonus on its saving throw. If the spell affects only a single creature not in combat at the time, the saving throw has a penalty of –2.
While the subject is fascinated by this spell, it reacts as though it were two steps more friendly in attitude. This allows you to make a single request of the affected creature (provided you can communicate with it). The request must be brief and reasonable. Even after the spell ends, the creature retains its new attitude toward you, but only with respect to that particular request.
A creature that fails its saving throw does not remember that you enspelled it.

 

[Dandu]

1. Unconscious creatures seem to be considered willing... which I personally disagree with.

2. No.

 

[Rhun]

1. Does a Unconscious creature get a will save against Mind-affecting spells like Dominate?

Yes (I don't see anything under the condition summary for Uconscious that would indicate they are willing or don't get their saves).

2.Could you use Hypnotism more than once to make a creature fanatical about what you asked it to do?

No.

 

[aluzer]

I understand balance wise neither should be allowed but is there anything to back that up rules wise?

 

[Greenfield]

The only obstacle I could see, in general, is that many charm/enchantment spells require that the target hear and/or understand what the caster is saying. Unconscious characters do neither.

Dominate Person specifically mentions a telepathic link though, so that spell would seem to bypass the requirement. I still wouldn't call them "willing" though, just because they're unconscious.

I know there's some mention of unconscious creatures counting as "willing" when it comes to spells like Teleport, but I can't find the specific mention in the SRD right now, so I don't know if that's a general rule or not.

Regarding the second question, spell effects from multiple castings of the same spell don't stack.

 

[Rhun]

The condition summary entry lists all negative effects of any given condition. Neither Unconscious or Helpless notes any penalties to will saves.

Unconscious
Knocked out and helpless. Unconsciousness can result from having current hit points between -1 and -9, or from nonlethal damage in excess of current hit points.

Helpless
A helpless character is paralyzed, held, bound, sleeping, unconscious, or otherwise completely at an opponent’s mercy. A helpless target is treated as having a Dexterity of 0 (-5 modifier). Melee attacks against a helpless target get a +4 bonus (equivalent to attacking a prone target). Ranged attacks gets no special bonus against helpless targets. Rogues can sneak attack helpless targets.

As a full-round action, an enemy can use a melee weapon to deliver a coup de grace to a helpless foe. An enemy can also use a bow or crossbow, provided he is adjacent to the target. The attacker automatically hits and scores a critical hit. (A rogue also gets her sneak attack damage bonus against a helpless foe when delivering a coup de grace.) If the defender survives, he must make a Fortitude save (DC 10 + damage dealt) or die.

Delivering a coup de grace provokes attacks of opportunity.

Creatures that are immune to critical hits do not take critical damage, nor do they need to make Fortitude saves to avoid being killed by a coup de grace.

 

[Eldritch_Lord]

1. Unconscious creatures seem to be considered willing... which I personally disagree with.

Note that this only applies to spells and effects requiring willing targets:

Some spells restrict you to willing targets only. Declaring yourself as a willing target is something that can be done at any time (even if you’re flat-footed or it isn’t your turn). Unconscious creatures are automatically considered willing, but a character who is conscious but immobile or helpless (such as one who is bound, cowering, grappling, paralyzed, pinned, or stunned) is not automatically willing.

"Willing" doesn't mean you waive your Will save, it just means that you can be healed or teleported away or whatever by your allies if you're knocked out.