A Doubters Review

[UngeheuerLich]

I agree that this has detracted a bit from the game for me as well. While Vancian Magic limited mages in 3.5, being able to continuosly spam magic somehow cheapens Magic as a whole in the game. I found that the "Big, Bad Mage" in the scenario was less effective than some of his minions simply because he could not deal as much damage as they could. His spell/power selections were simply not as powerful as the martial power selection of his cohorts. Mages simply will not be as respected nor as feared as they were in previous editions. That role will, perhaps, go to the Ranger, who Devyn aptly described as a food processor. I was simply blown away by his damage output potential. Perhaps as they increase in level and become more versatile, the mage will recapture that mysterious feeling he had. I can say that I was disappointed to find most all the mage's spells to be combat oriented. Perhaps the spell selection was made with the specific module in mind, or perhaps, like others have suggested, combat options have checkmated more role-playing/problem solving aspects of a mage's spell list. I hope not.

Before 3rd edition you had to be at least a Level 5 magic user to be anything helpful to your party in fights (3rd level spells + maxed 1st level spells), and you were 5th level when other chars were already 6th or 7th... (except when you used utility spells like grease etc)

In 3.x you could help a bit from beginning, but still a d4+1 mm is terrible compared to the d12+6 damage axe...

And right now, the wizard does some damage and his daily spells seem quite powerfull...

Spells in 3.5 were already very dull... in ADnD or 3.0 your spells could do wonderfull thinks... were terribly imbalanced and versatile... in 3.5 most versatile spells were broken up into different spells and were sometimes put on a lower spell level... scorching ray/flame arrow e.g. making them overpowered and dull...

 

[Aria Silverhands]

I think you're underestimating the capabilities of low level wizards with sleep, grease, silent image and other similar spells.

 

[StarFyre]

sorry

sorry..i should have mentioned..

We use the 2E spells and magic detailed spell crit hit tables as well.

Fireball, in our use, causes heat/fire, but is also an explosion...so it has force.

Lightning bolt also can splinter and destroy things...you don't even want to know what sorts of chaos a meteor swarm can do

hehe

We like all that stuff, since it allows friends who think about a situation, ways to do things instead of the illogical toe to toe combat that happens most of the time in games.

For example, they had to raid a temple...they actually found a way (with and without magic!!!) that made sense, to bring down 3 of the support pillars in the main cahmber. I had to do quick rolls, etc and it ended up bring down part of the upper levels.

It changed totally how the area played out...but was great.

SO far, I see how this can be done in 4E VERY easily..but sadly, no one does in what we have read.

Sanjay

 

[Digital M@]

Nice review.

I think that the early levels may seem more cumbersome vs previous versions due to the increased options, powers, being bloodied etc. This may quickly balance out in favor of being simplified as the characters gain levels, but only playing will tell.

I think the streamlining was really focused on DMing, the players have many powers etc but putting together and running the adventure seems to be easier (I say this, but have no evidence except what I have read on ENworld)

I am looking forward to more dynamic battles. In 3E I used bridges, slick surfaces, traps, cliffs etc, but they rarely came into play. first of all, due to the skill system, no one could make the saves and combat was very static from a movement point of view once things got sarted.

3.x really frustrated me with all of the new PrC's and powers from any of 100 publishers. It was very hard to track and my players felt no guilt in min maxing a character that looked balanced until about 7th lvl and then everything kicked in. Anyway, that does not matter, I am looking forward to a new RPG experience, I think new versions help keep my interest and push the industry in new directions. Hopefully, I can find a good group to play.

 

[Ebon Shar]

...I am looking forward to a new RPG experience, I think new versions help keep my interest and push the industry in new directions. Hopefully, I can find a good group to play.

Can you drive down to Bellingham twice a month?

 

[Festivus]

I'd like a comparison of a level 20 3.5e arcane spellcaster to a level 30 4e arcane spellcaster. One of my peeves with 3.5e is all the crap I have to track... buffs, spell effects, spell durations... god forbid we get hit with an area dispel, it stops the game cold for 20 minutes while we figure out who lost what effects and recalculate. I really like the 4E save every round to rid an effect, it stops the fighter in the corner because he's been paralyzed by a ghoul.