A good romance?

[Kanachi]

(This is a long one but please stick with me if you have the time)

Hiya everyone,

This ones a bit of a hard one to put out here, so please try to be sensitive to that fact as I guess I feel a little awkward doing so. Anyway,

One of my PC and an NPC have slowly been growing what I would call “a romance” and as a DM this is the first time I’ve really encountered this kind of situation. We are all adults and I don’t want to handle this kind of thing like a teenager “19 + 4 that means I score!” so yer, I’ve tried to make something which I think will work. We are both guys, I’m in a relationship, and he is my life long best friend so this is definitely not some kind of RL transference thing (just in case you’re wondering).

Anyway, I’ll give you a very brief rundown of the world and the characters.

Basically the setting is a bit like the movie waterworld, except there are small island nations which break things up and sailing vessels are the norm. The known world is surrounded by an entity simply called “the shadow” which is basically a rolling smog of pure chaos which destroys anything that enters it.

Vidar (the PC) came from the shadow itself (via a long still unfolding story I won’t explain here) and has basically been playing the “I must do good to combat the evil from which I was born” archetype.

Kaori (the NPC) is the last of a people known as the Delquee, who are essentially a type of humanoid whose ancient ancestors hail from the element of earth. She’s the daughter of the “Shadow watcher” who was basically the guy in charge of keeping the shadow at bay.

As you can imagine their interactions started on a pretty rocky (no pun intended) footing, but in the 10+ sessions since that time they have bonded to be pretty close. Hence I have reached this point.

My idea is that she will ask to speak with him and then in a private aside (we have a room we keep away from the other players) I read out the following:

“My people don’t believe in the afterlife... your gods serve men, dwarfs, elves and those born of the soul.

My people… My people grew from the world itself and to it we shall return as an echo which chimes forever in the dark still of stone, soil and sand.

You can’t hear them Vidar… but I do.

They are a million lives flowing within the earth,
drifting as glass and salt upon the oceans waves.

So many lives lost… but so many lives lived!

Their echoes crash as silent thunder upon the open rock.”

She leans back into the arch of the window and pauses for a moment.

“I know my father loved me…

for I was his daughter and he loved me as any father should.

But he was never proud. I never gave him reason to be…

I was always too quiet in way

and too silent in action.

I was so fearful of risk that I would never wager…

It was not until I heard of his death that I broke from myself

and it was not until my people faded into extinction that I became the leader I was always meant to be.”

She grips you by the arm and draws you close.

“So many lives lost Vidar… So many… and yet still I was too afraid to live!

I’m the last of my kind, there will be no other…

Tell me now what songs will the stone sing when I die?

What words will I give to the darkness when I slip from the light?”

Heavy tears well within her eyes and she draws in a sharp quivering breath in a vain hope to hold them back.

Still with me? awesome!


Ok so once, I’ve read that out, he will obviously have to talk her into some kind of positive frame of light. Which he no doubt will, and that’s simple role play which we can both handle. Now at that point if he has done things right I will give him the following to read:

She moves as though to embrace you, but pauses at the last… like an arrow notched and drawn, waiting for its mark. A nervous, thrilling silence passes between you both.

Her unspoken words talk of devotion,
of love
of whatever life she would wish into this world
if it were only hers to command.

Her silent yearnings hang as heavy as heart upon the silence that smoulders between you.

If you choose to embrace her take the sheet the DM has laid out for you otherwise return this sheet to the DM.

If he takes the note he will then read this:

She holds you for a long moment, allowing her sorrow to dissipate and dissolve into the air as a gentle calm washes over you both. She turns, slowly within your arms, and touches her lips to yours with a soft and peaceful warmth.

As she rises up within your embrace her hair falls free from its bonds. Its soft texture flows as silk upon your skin - framing you both as one and warding away the world and its troubles.

An echo sounds within your soul with each kiss and a rhythmic song sings within your heart with every moment you are together.

There is no order,
there is no chaos,
there is no time eternal
or shadow forever…

For now at least

there is simply “more”

and you know that from this day forth

there always will be!

If he does not take the note I will read out the following:

“I know it may not seem as much, but I stand with you Vidar… all my people do, for they sing for us all.”

She holds your arm for a long moment and then draws away to exit the room, turning once only to glace, smile and dream. Sometime that is all that any can do.

Anyway.. I’m sorry for an epic post and I'm not the worlds best writer as you can see, but I guess my question is simple. Is this a good way to handle things? Would you as a player like this kind of thing if a romance between you and a NPC were to initiate?

 

[pauljathome]

The following is NOT intended to be dismissive. I'm trying to give my opinion in a constructive way for you to take or ignore as you choose.

It seems too scripted to me. And a little over the top.

I think that you'd be better served to keep all the ideas embedded in the above but to NOT script it. Rather, initiate the conversation and see where it goes. Your NPC kind of knows the way she sees the conversation going but that is more that she has rehearsed it in front of the mirror . And, as we all know, no plan survives contact with the PCs.

So, I'd start with maybe the first couple of paragraphs and then let the PC react.

One thing that I think key in roleplaying relationships is that neither the player nor the character should feel like they are being railroaded. They should be in control.

 

[kitsune9]

Roleplaying romance is something that never appealed to me. I can't suspend the disbelief when the guy across the table from me is supposed to be playing some beautiful elven maiden against my NPC dude and he's 300 lb and belching out his chips and soda all over himself while being in character. Pass.

As DM, if one of my players wants to be romantic with an NPC, it's yay or nay and then we move on.

 

[D'karr]

Roleplaying romance is something that never appealed to me. I can't suspend the disbelief when the guy across the table from me is supposed to be playing some beautiful elven maiden against my NPC dude and he's 300 lb and belching out his chips and soda all over himself while being in character. Pass.

As DM, if one of my players wants to be romantic with an NPC, it's yay or nay and then we move on.

But those are belches of "luv".

 

[kitsune9]

But those are belches of "luv".

Definitely. Creepy too.

 

[JustKim]

I think it's important for my characters to have a love interest, so I tend to develop a romance with a PC or NPC for any game that lasts long enough. And as a DM I return the favor. I play with a mix of adult men and woman and we are fully comfortable with this sort of thing.

I agree that the event is scripted and I feel that something more genuine and off the cuff would be more satisfying. But not everybody can do that well, and I'll be honest, your sheet idea is amazing.

It's amazing because your player is confronted with a possibility. On the other side is some development. If they return the sheet, they will never know what that development was. It's human nature to want to read what's on that sheet, even if it feels a little scripted. It seems like a comfortable compromise for all involved, and the delivery is very cool.

So even though my approach would be different, I think this is a great idea.

 

[S'mon]

Anyway.. I’m sorry for an epic post and I'm not the worlds best writer as you can see, but I guess my question is simple. Is this a good way to handle things? Would you as a player like this kind of thing if a romance between you and a NPC were to initiate?

Yes - it seems potentially powerful, and moving, and it's not badly written.

BUT: it is much too long, and heavily scripted. I can see the advantage in having several possible lines pre-written, but this Wall of Text is a big turn off. You're there to GM a game, not write a novel. The most important character there is the PC, not your NPC. What actually matters is how the PC (re)acts. Give him something to riff off, certainly. Don't bury him in text.

So - assuming you know your player and you're both comfy with romance, potentially this is great. I get a very 'Avatar' vibe here. Who doesn't want to be the hero who gets the beautiful princess? But you need to cut it way down and focus on what will happen in actual play, not on your pre-written idea of what will happen.

 

[S'mon]

Definitely. Creepy too.

How about if it's an attractive female GM, as most of mine are?

 

[S'mon]

As a player, do you have a preferred gender for your GM?

deleted - wrong place

 

[kitsune9]

How about if it's an attractive female GM, as most of mine are?

If you game with a group that looks like the cast of 90210 or Glee! it really helps suspends the disbelief. I can accede on that point.

But if you game with......my group....then enjoy the nightmare.

 

[S'mon]

If you game with a group that looks like the cast of 90210 or Glee! it really helps suspends the disbelief. I can accede on that point.

OK, clearly our concepts of 'attractive' differ somewhat... or are you a 13 year old girl?

 

[kitsune9]

OK, clearly our concepts of 'attractive' differ somewhat... or are you a 13 year old girl?

Okay, okay. I should have said, "If your game group looks like the cast of [insert your own idea of hot, attractive TV stars here] then..."

 

[jorgeo]

Why not initiate the romance with a short letter from the NPC? That way you give the player some warning of what's to come, and they can follow through or not.

It might also be easier to do live-action romance talk by reacting to a situation (answering the written letter) than creating it (engaging the PC privately).

 

[Barastrondo]

This is very similar to what they used to call "blue-booking." To swipe from the RPGnet wiki because I am lazy:

'Bluebooking' was first described by Aaron Allston in the Champions supplement "Strike Force". The 'blue book' in question is a standard (in the U.S.) blue book used to answer essay questions during exams. Instead of using it to figure out whether you passed or failed, the blue book was used for in-character dialogues, especially of the sort that many (presumably male) gamers might find uncomfortable.

Bluebooking describes short gaming sessions that do not involve the entire group, but which instead focus on the actions of one or a few characters.

Bluebooking is nothing more than writing out roleplaying and conversations between characters, rather than acting them out usually this takes place between game sessions these scenes could include:

thoughts or plans the character is having
private conversations with NPCs
private conversations between other PCs
past history (or future?!!) scenes
questions to the GM
etc...


Sometimes players feel uncomfortable acting out some scenes, or will want to keep some scenes private. We also use it to flesh out background events. Roleplaying character romances for example, can be very uncomfortable to do verbally in a game session setting, especially if there's a gender difference between the player/GM and the character. Admittedly modern e-mail can replace a lot of this type of interaction. This presents a perfect opportunity to use bluebooking. Bluebooking also has the advantage of permanence; you keep the written records of what went on, and can use them to create future scenarios.

This is a pretty old technique; the Strike Force supplement came out in '88. So you can see this sort of thing works. Of course, it's all dependent on the players. What works for one is not necessarily so for another.

S'mon's correct in that it's probably too long. I could see something like this working in a chat room format: where a few lines of text appear, and if you don't see "Vidar is typing..." you then put in a few more lines, and so on. However, it assumes a lot if the PC is expected to sit quietly through a long speech -- the two of them aren't really having a conversation. It's more alternating monologues.

Also I would personally avoid terms like "nervous, thrilling silence passes between you both." Don't tell the player his character is nervous, or thrilled. Let him figure that out. More importantly, let him have an opportunity to tell or show you how his character feels, if he's comfortable doing that. He may be content in letting you write the romance for him; it's one way players might react. But he might also become less engaged if at any point he feels "wait, that doesn't seem like something Vidar would do."

 

[Zelda Themelin]

I tend to have romance stuff with my characters. Usually it's about married for profit or getting laid for pleasure.

I think love laden (potentially tragic) things are kinda hard to play. If it happens it's more often between pc and pc rather than pc and npc. Thing is when I actually want to roleplay more romantic relationship I want to control bit how it becomes. With another pc you can play it for laughs and some drama and there is no danger that some plot-stuff disturb it. Npc:s are bit too much plot-devices, so it's not equal an relationship. It is perfect way to dark fate and that kinda things. I guess I don't roleplay with people who believe in happy endins. Or that relationship should be just backdrop that doesn't interact with any other things in game.

Even my sister who likes reading romantic fantasy books, prefers to play characters who kill monsters and take their stuff. Her chosen micro-game is merchant-game, not romance related.

I think romance roleplaying games only works with certain groups and in some cases 1to1 games of boyfriend and girlfrind (huspand/wife/somebody you have romantic relationsip). I've known people who like to pretend this stuff, and no, it was not the all-girl-groups. Those things often got played by guys who liked to watch anime (especilly that meant for little girls). They do highschool manga esque romance. Back to 90:s there were lot of white wolf gamers that included more serious romance in games. But I think it was more part of that style of gaming than your regular D&D.

I assume OP knowns the people in question like this stuff. Personally I'd be careful with too much details. Because well, you might be able to do it such finely written way, but surprised player might not do the lines so well at all, and that could ruin the fun in it. Don't make too many assumptions. Give player actually change to play it and make the choices.

 

[S'mon]

S'mon's correct in that it's probably too long. I could see something like this working in a chat room format: where a few lines of text appear, and if you don't see "Vidar is typing..." you then put in a few more lines, and so on. "

I found DMing a romance scene or two worked well in my Dragonsfoot AD&D chatroom 'Yggsburgh' game, except for the ribald comments from the peanut gallery - the other players were fine, but we play in the public 1e AD&D chatroom so random grognards would wander in, see the lovey-dovey text, and well you can guess their reaction...

Personally I'm happy to play a 19 year old female aristocrat in a tabletop game as much as in an online game, but I think plenty of players do find it easier to suspend disbelief in the latter case!

Anyway, when GMing a romance plot, I have a general idea of the NPC's attitude and motivations, but I don't plan/script stuff out, at most I might think of a line or so. Mostly it's more about getting in a sort of "What would Jane Austen/a Jane Austen heroine do?" sort of mindset - I use a lot of early-19th-century tropes for the Yggsburgh game. I always try to get inside the NPC's head as that helps make them seem like real people, and novel analogies are very useful for that, especially stuff which cares a bit about people's psychology, rather than focusing on action.

 

[Piratecat]

We've had a bunch of romance plots -- PC & PC, PC & NPC -- and I really like what you're trying to do. I agree that it's probably too long, and a bit too scripted. Once you get started I think if she talks from the heart, and reveals emotional vulnerability that shows she trusts him, you're going to be fine.

 

[haakon1]

when GMing a romance plot, I have a general idea of the NPC's attitude and motivations, but I don't plan/script stuff out, at most I might think of a line or so. Mostly it's more about getting in a sort of "What would Jane Austen/a Jane Austen heroine do?" sort of mindset - I use a lot of early-19th-century tropes for the Yggsburgh game. I always try to get inside the NPC's head as that helps make them seem like real people, and novel analogies are very useful for that, especially stuff which cares a bit about people's psychology, rather than focusing on action.

I definitely like to role play the NPCs (not a roll a d20 to seduce approach!), and I keep in mind that their world is more old fashioned than ours.

That said, my anti-creepiness rules of thumb would be:
1) Romance should be optional -- if the player isn't "into it", it will not come up. NPC's can signal being attracted to PC's, but if the PLAYER isn't interested in that aspect of role playing, let it be.

2) Sex should be a "scene cut" thing, like an old movie. OK, Butch the Barbarian and Booberella the Bar Maid and talking softly in the corner, and then sneak upstairs for the evening. Next morning, Butch is putting on his boots when . . .

I'm sure there are more I haven't thought of.

 

[S'mon]

I definitely like to role play the NPCs (not a roll a d20 to seduce approach!), and I keep in mind that their world is more old fashioned than ours.

That said, my anti-creepiness rules of thumb would be:
1) Romance should be optional -- if the player isn't "into it", it will not come up. NPC's can signal being attracted to PC's, but if the PLAYER isn't interested in that aspect of role playing, let it be.

2) Sex should be a "scene cut" thing, like an old movie. OK, Butch the Barbarian and Booberella the Bar Maid and talking softly in the corner, and then sneak upstairs for the evening. Next morning, Butch is putting on his boots when . . .

I'm sure there are more I haven't thought of.

Yes, I follow both those rules. Scene cuts pretty much go without saying. On #1, I agree also. Many players are not interested in or are averse to romance in their D&D. IME interest in a romance plot is more common with my Dragonsfoot chatroom games both because of the medium, the text chatroom is a lot more amenable to a romance subplot than is a crowded, noisy pub function room at the D&D Meetup. But I think it's also because the DF grognards are used to being highly proactive in their play, looking for opportunities - and romance can be used for social advancement of their PCs (romance the high-status aristocrat) or to gain a powerful ally (romance the hawt Paladin girl). Few people in my tabletop groups seem to have the same attitude to the campaign milieu, that it is there to be manipulated/conquered, combined with awareness of possibilities outside of combat. Eg a barbarian PC Varek rescued a barbarian princess from another Altanian clan, passed up the opportunity to romance her, and was kicking himself when she took up with his friend Rameses, an ex-PC barbarian NPC, instead. And Varek is one of the most proactive PCs IMCs, most players wouldn't have even realised there was an opportunity there to begin with.

I think player obliviousness can be a bit of a problem, if the player would be interested in a romance plot, but doesn't realise it's a possibility. I'm not generally going to have NPCs throw themselves at the PCs either, although Jaryn the fallen Paladin BBEG did attempt to court Esmerelda the high-CHA Bard PC. So that's something I struggle with a bit and don't really have a solution for - I would quite like to have more romance in my tabletop games the way there is in my Dragonsfoot AD&D games, but I haven't found a good way to get there yet.

 

[Evilhalfling]

I tend to do romance when I'm playing in one shots - if its available.
that way I can throw myself into the role, and not worry about maintaining that level of attention, RP over the long term. Two long remembered games are one where I was a female author in Call of Cthulu, and had a very proper/subtle flirty relationship with a PC Valet. He died protecting his master, with one last look my way. (in a TPK). In a very social game I married another PC, blowing off some plots to do so. The fact that her child wasn't mine never occurred to me.

As a DM I will throw in potential love interests, or partners and see if the player is interested in taking it farther. Rarely does it get fully RP out but "She invites you to dinner at her mansion and seems more interested in you by the end of the evening, but offers only a kiss." Would be a typical situation.
The last campaign had a Cassanova-type player who after many conquests had to pay child support, and deal with a clingy baby-momma.