A level & demographic question

[Quickleaf]

I've read many good threads about the frequency of various character class levels & demographics. I haven't been able to find a consensus, but all seem to agree the DMG is totally off.

I am writing a high-level adventure (12th-18th levels) that involves a noble court with many high-level NPCs. All of these are NPCs with standard classes (no Experts, Warriors, Adepts, or Aristocrats). Most have lots of political influence, servants, and wealth. Most have very little access to spells or magic items.

How big would the city's population need to be to accomodate this number of high-level NPCs? What conclusions would you draw about a society with a large number of high-level characters ruling a mostly low-level commoners? Is this too many high-level characters? Or is there a way to make it work?

The exact numbers per class level:
2 x 17th level
1 x 16th level
2 x 15th level
2 x 14th level
2 x 13th level
2 x 12th level
1 x 11th level
2 x 10th level

 

[gizmo33]

Demographics is something that always works as designed. The only answer to the question I can think of is to work out a demographics system and then use it to get the answer. You must have at least 14 people living in the city

From what info you've posted - there's no reason you can't use the DMG system.

 

[Kid Charlemagne]

I'd certainly like a different system than the one in the DMG.

However, keep in mind that a court like the one you propose breaks the norms in many ways that aren't considered in the standard system - its drawing high level folks from all over the country and even the world, so the percentages of high level characters will necessarily be higher.

 

[Psion]

AFAICT, the DMG system is not intended as a straightjacket and is only a guideline or tool. I think that it is something you can consider, but would be very artificial to stand in the way of adventure design.

Use to rules! Don't let the rules use you!

 

[Zenodotus of Ephesus]

I think it is more telling that this is, by your own description, a city, for one, and a city where such NPCs would congregate for a meeting, right? Any way you slice it it sounds like you want it to be at least "(small or large) city" size so you only have to decide if one of those is large enough or if you'd like it to be a metropolis.

In general, I'd say if it is a smallish kingdom with few cities, you can error to the small side. If this is an empire, lean toward metropolis. If this is a typical kingdom in your world with a fair number of good-sized population centers, plunk it in the middle of the large city range.

Other things to consider are the nature of the kingdom and the surroundings. This may contradict what I said above. Is this like Italy during the Renaissance with a good number of cultural centers or like the Mongol Empire with vast stretches of land and nomadic people?

Tell us more of this kingdom if you'd like more advice, please.

 

[Quickleaf]

It's based on Sassanid Persia cerca 600 AD pre-Moslem invasion. It's roughly half the size of Iran (876,000 sq. miles or so). I'm thinking the total population of the nation is 600,000-900,000. And there are 4 main cities. This city (Bar Tehraz) is the second largest, something like 150,000 people I'm guesstimating. It used to be the capital before it was moved 100 years ago.

 

[Kilmore]

Normal rules do not apply to any capital city. The local ruler and other people and organizations may make arbitrary rules that affect the populations of higher level characters, generally in the direction of attracting higher numbers of managable classes (wizards, fighters, clerics, bards, maybe paladins) and discouraging the unmanageable (rogue, barbarian, sorcerer, tree huggers). Of course, the higher level one is, the fewer rules he or she has to listen to.

 

[S'mon]

It's based on Sassanid Persia cerca 600 AD pre-Moslem invasion. It's roughly half the size of Iran (876,000 sq. miles or so). I'm thinking the total population of the nation is 600,000-900,000. And there are 4 main cities. This city (Bar Tehraz) is the second largest, something like 150,000 people I'm guesstimating. It used to be the capital before it was moved 100 years ago.

I think your nation population should be about 10 times larger at least (6-7 million) if you want 2 cities of 150,000+. Historically you didn't see urban populations much over 8% before the industrial revolution. Your court demographics are fine though.

 

[howandwhy99]

It's based on Sassanid Persia cerca 600 AD pre-Moslem invasion. It's roughly half the size of Iran (876,000 sq. miles or so). I'm thinking the total population of the nation is 600,000-900,000. And there are 4 main cities. This city (Bar Tehraz) is the second largest, something like 150,000 people I'm guesstimating. It used to be the capital before it was moved 100 years ago.

Well, it just so happens I have been working on an adventure, which uses the Sassinid period of the Persian Empire too. Only I've been focusing more on the art and architecture. Their structures are ancient in this module.

I agree with the other posters advice to keep city populations down to a low percentage of overall population. But I think geography is going to have a bigger effect here than normal. I would put the majority of the population along the fertile cresent rivers and the mediterranean coastline. People could live in the center of those lands, but the farming just isn't as sustainable. Present day Turkey's area being slightly different.

I'm guessing you could either eyeball it, (meaning no number is needed more than local densities) or ignore it all together. Power level is really only going to reflect the degree of "fantasy" in the end. How many around who are using magic.

 

[Quickleaf]

Thanks! Yep, I'll be dropping the city population to about 80,000. Most cities are along the coast, fertile crescent rivers, or the caspian sea.

Howandwhy, mind telling me a little about how you're using Sassinid Persia in your adventure? I'd love to swap ideas.