D&D 5E A melee Hexblade

Adb0782

Explorer
Basically che idea is to mix it with Battlemaster for some more short rest resource and Divine Soul for some spells, better saves, extended and quickened metamagic, and for the chance to use the Trance of the elf (that need to be in trance for just 4 hours for gain the benefits of a long rest) for keep 4 hours every night (that mean 4 short rest) for convert short rest slots in Sorcery Points and than the SP in temporary slots.

The most obvius split seem to be HB 12/BM 4/DS 4 getting pact of the blade. Starting Fighter for the CON saves and getting blind fighting style (or defence as it gonna wear medium armors for better initiative and better saves on dex, but blind fighting style let me choose some other cool invocation instead than devil's sight. Superior Tecnique was something i also was thinking about), than 5 lv of Hexblade for 3rd lv spells, extra attack, eldricht mind, improved pact weapon, hex warrior and 2 very important spells like Hex and Armor of Agathys (in this way till lv 7 he will almost never use the shield spell, but my campaign starts at lv 5 so probably it's not a big deal for me). Here we gonna add 4 lv of DS for get metamagic and spiritual weapon (also Aid and Warding Bond are very nice spells) for a good use of our Bonus Action, we also add some slots for have much more shield spell casted during battle and from lv 8th we can start to use metamagic for create more slots after a long rest of 4 hours, lv 9 gives us 2nd lv DS spells and lv 10 a feat. At this point we gonna add 3 lv more of Battle Master, for get action surge, manuvers that recharges also with short rest and other asi, than all in for the Hexblade till lv 12 where we get lifedrinker (Fighter 1/Hexblade 5/ Divine Soul 4/Battle Master 3/Hexblade 7).

Asi's should be Elven accuracy +1 CHA @5, +2 CHA @10, GWM @13, Lucky @17 (or whatever give us +1 wis, but i beliebe Lucky is better)
Stats are rolled and should be 11 STR, 14 DEX, 16 CON, 12 INT, 13 WIS, 17 CHA (including already racial bonuses, and i choose, with tasha's custom lineage, an elf with +2 CHA and +1 CON). Can be done with point buy anyway with 8 str, 14 dex, 14 con, 10 int, 11 wis, 17 cha.

As i said we start from lv 5. The first lv is abit tought, but than things seem going better. I would choose mostly spells with a long duration (for use extended metamagic efficiently), especially the concentration ones (hex, especially in the beginning is a big help), for exemple from lv 6 he is able to cast Summon Fey (1 hour duration), i would choose the trickery, with blind figting style he can cast darknes on the character 5 ft square, attack, and than run away from the obscured square (the character simply let him pass) without get OA's. In this situation our warlock have advantage to hit and disadvantage to be hitted by things that dont have blindsight and similar, without affecting anyone else with the darkness, while the fey is kinda safe thanks to that 5 ft of darkness, running away without risks + he boost its damage if the fey gonna hit (was also thinking about warding bond with the fey, but im not sure it's a great idea). Later on, with Spiritual Weapon and manuvers he gonna fill its bonus action and its reaction for more damage and short rest resources, and once he get GWM he should be kinda powerful, as also about defense (hight AC) and CON saves it is pretty good with +3 on the stat, proficiency, advantage (eldricht mind) and eventually the 2d4 from DS, plus he get adavantage on being charmed becouse it is an elf and it have proficiency in WIS saves. I give up things like spirit guardians for the short duration, however in campaigns that don't get lv 20 is probably good to go till lv 5 DS or even more.

All this said, do you think it gonna work enough well? Do you have some advice to make it better?

PS as arcanum i thought to get soul cage, Catnap is other spell i would get for sure once i get the manuvers.
 
Last edited:

log in or register to remove this ad

I played a Hexblade to 19th level, and took feats late in the campaign Martial initiate and fighting initiate to get maneuvers but by then, I kept forgetting I even had them. I was using eldritch Smite and that was very effective. I didn't usually use Lifedrinker with is a great eldritch invocation usually but I had Bracers of Illusion so it didn't often matter to me either. I used Greenflame Blade and Eldritch Smite which I could then cast a second time if needed, smite when I hit and often do enough damage to drop a foe. Improved Pact Weapon is great too. My Hexblade made a Sunblade and having the ability to change the form of a Pact Weapon made it a greatsword instead of Longsword. He was also useful at loot time. He could bond with a weapon that noone in the party wanted, change it to some other more useful weapon for an ally, then unbond with it and give it to them.
 

Adb0782

Explorer
I played a Hexblade to 19th level, and took feats late in the campaign Martial initiate and fighting initiate to get maneuvers but by then, I kept forgetting I even had them. I was using eldritch Smite and that was very effective. I didn't usually use Lifedrinker with is a great eldritch invocation usually but I had Bracers of Illusion so it didn't often matter to me either. I used Greenflame Blade and Eldritch Smite which I could then cast a second time if needed, smite when I hit and often do enough damage to drop a foe. Improved Pact Weapon is great too. My Hexblade made a Sunblade and having the ability to change the form of a Pact Weapon made it a greatsword instead of Longsword. He was also useful at loot time. He could bond with a weapon that noone in the party wanted, change it to some other more useful weapon for an ally, then unbond with it and give it to them.
Well, i suppose you didn't get also thirsting blade, but while probably your build is much more focus on nova and it have highter spells and higher slots (and also get lifedrinker much earlier), the character that im trying to create it's much more about deal constant damage every turn and, while the hexblade tend to have only 2/3 short rest slots for almost all the way, this character have much more slots for use the shield spell and SW, as the concentration spell (lower lv of course), much more superiority die for be able to add it almost 3 times every fight with catnap (and in a fight of 5 rounds its a lot) and i hope (as this was the intent) more versatility. My doubt come from the fact that i'm not sure to delay some ability or spells too much, becouse if it is the case it gonna be kinda underpowered as in the group there are a fighter/barbarian and a healer life cleric/celestial warlock that are kinda optimized.

PS about magic items, we normally roll the loots, so it is totally random and so i won't focus on magic items that im not sure to can find or buy,
 

FrogReaver

As long as i get to be the frog
Basically che idea is to mix it with Battlemaster for some more short rest resource and Divine Soul for some spells, better saves, extended and quickened metamagic, and for the chance to use the Trance of the elf (that need to be in trance for just 4 hours for gain the benefits of a long rest) for keep 4 hours every night (that mean 4 short rest) for convert short rest slots in Sorcery Points and than the SP in temporary slots.

The most obvius split seem to be HB 12/BM 4/DS 4 getting pact of the blade. Starting Fighter for the CON saves and getting blind fighting style (or defence as it gonna wear medium armors for better initiative and better saves on dex, but blind fighting style let me choose some other cool invocation instead than devil's sight. Superior Tecnique was something i also was thinking about), than 5 lv of Hexblade for 3rd lv spells, extra attack, eldricht mind, improved pact weapon, hex warrior and 2 very important spells like Hex and Armor of Agathys (in this way till lv 7 he will almost never use the shield spell, but my campaign starts at lv 5 so probably it's not a big deal for me). Here we gonna add 4 lv of DS for get metamagic and spiritual weapon (also Aid and Warding Bond are very nice spells) for a good use of our Bonus Action, we also add some slots for have much more shield spell casted during battle and from lv 8th we can start to use metamagic for create more slots after a long rest of 4 hours, lv 9 gives us 2nd lv DS spells and lv 10 a feat. At this point we gonna add 3 lv more of Battle Master, for get action surge, manuvers that recharges also with short rest and other asi, than all in for the Hexblade till lv 12 where we get lifedrinker (Fighter 1/Hexblade 5/ Divine Soul 4/Battle Master 3/Hexblade 7).

Asi's should be Elven accuracy +1 CHA @5, +2 CHA @10, GWM @13, Lucky @17 (or whatever give us +1 wis, but i beliebe Lucky is better)
Stats are rolled and should be 11 STR, 14 DEX, 16 CON, 12 INT, 13 WIS, 17 CHA (including already racial bonuses, and i choose, with tasha's custom lineage, an elf with +2 CHA and +1 CON). Can be done with point buy anyway with 8 str, 14 dex, 14 con, 10 int, 11 wis, 17 cha.

As i said we start from lv 5. The first lv is abit tought, but than things seem going better. I would choose mostly spells with a long duration (for use extended metamagic efficiently), especially the concentration ones (hex, especially in the beginning is a big help), for exemple from lv 6 he is able to cast Summon Fey (1 hour duration), i would choose the trickery, with blind figting style he can cast darknes on the character 5 ft square, attack, and than run away from the obscured square (the character simply let him pass) without get OA's. In this situation our warlock have advantage to hit and disadvantage to be hitted by things that dont have blindsight and similar, without affecting anyone else with the darkness, while the fey is kinda safe thanks to that 5 ft of darkness, running away without risks + he boost its damage if the fey gonna hit (was also thinking about warding bond with the fey, but im not sure it's a great idea). Later on, with Spiritual Weapon and manuvers he gonna fill its bonus action and its reaction for more damage and short rest resources, and once he get GWM he should be kinda powerful, as also about defense (hight AC) and CON saves it is pretty good with +3 on the stat, proficiency, advantage (eldricht mind) and eventually the 2d4 from DS, plus he get adavantage on being charmed becouse it is an elf and it have proficiency in WIS saves. I give up things like spirit guardians for the short duration, however in campaigns that don't get lv 20 is probably good to go till lv 5 DS or even more.

All this said, do you think it gonna work enough well? Do you have some advice to make it better?

PS as arcanum i thought to get soul cage, Catnap is other spell i would get for sure once i get the manuvers.

To critique:
  • Your level 5 is going to suck.
  • One thing I dislike about your summon fey darkness plan is that it's turn is immediately after yours. So you won't normally gain advantage till round 2. If you weren't able to precast the fey you'll be missing out on your first round of attacks as well. Fights don't usually last too many rounds. 4ish rounds is a good estimate.
  • Reaction attacks aren't reliable - some encounters you may get 1 every round and some you may not get one at all due to the trigger never occuring. Meaning the battlemaster manuevers may go to waste more often than you hope. Also your reaction shield spells that you want the sorcerer for somewhat compete with that as well.
  • You are completely unfocused on mobility - which is huge for a melee character. Using misty step to close in the times you can't reach an enemy is probably a much better use of spare level 2 slots than spiritual weapon
  • The lack of wisdom save proficiency is really going to hurt.
  • You seem to have no focus for the character - you want it all and to fill out every action type instead of enhancing the ones you are already using - or at lesat weighing whether increased focus on your current actions may payoff more than gaining other action types.

Positives:
  • Any combo that can grant advantage while using elven accuracy and GWM is solid.
  • Strong Damage
  • Not solely focused on offense
A Fresh Take:
Let's start looking at what a single class hexblade might look like,
Level 5
  • Thirsting Blade Invocation, Devil's Sight Invocation, Fiendish Vigor Invocation.
  • Important Combat Spells - Summon Fey. Hex/Spirit (for when the action cost of summon fey seems to high). Misty Step/Thunderstep. Armor of Agathys.
  • ASI = Resilient Con - For con save proficiency. (Alternate version might trade Fiendish Vigor Invocation for Eldritch Mind and Resilient Con for Elven Accuracy - the reason I didn't was because I'm a little more concerned with survivability than offense)
*Advantage from Summon Fey + Devil's Sight Combo is still really strong even without Elven Accuracy.


Level 8
  • Spell slot levels continue to improve. (Summon Fey is now always cast in a level 4 slot - meaning it gets 2 attacks as well).
  • 1 additional invocation (probably for eldritch mind).
  • ASI = Elven Accuracy
  • Accursed Specter (minor damage boost but otherwise free damage and has a decent attack bonus due to gaining your charisma bonus to it's attacks. If attacked it can soak a few hits due to it's resistance to most damage types).


Level 12
  • You've gained 2 more invocations. 1 of which is Lifedrinker (+5 damage on each attack - yay). Possibly do agonizing blast for when you absolutely can't reach an enemy in melee.
  • 3 slots now instead of 2, all level 5.
  • 1 level 6 spell.
  • ASI = GWM. Having a consistent source of Advantage with Elven Accuracy will make this better than +2 Cha IMO.
  • Armor of Hexes - Really Strong but limited uses.


The question is how does your mutliclass version compare at various levels. At level 5 you are missing out on too much. But I think we know level 5 will be rough.

By level 8 you will look something like
  • Invocations. Thirsting Blade, Eldritch Mind, Fiendish Vigor (I'm assuming you get a magic weapon by level 8)
  • Spells. You'll have an additional 3 level 1 slots (mostly for shield). However, you won't be able to cast summon fey at 4th level and you won't have any situational 4th level spells like banishment or dimension door.
  • You'll have metamagic but limited sorcery points. Extend Spell or quicken spell for Summon Fey does sound very useful though.
  • You won't have the accursed Specter.
By level 12 you will look something like
  • Same invocations as before
  • 1 additional level 2 slot than before
  • 1 more sorcery point than before
  • +Action Surge (huge addition)
  • +3 battlemaster manuever and 4 superiority dice (manuevers probably riposte, brace and Precision)
  • +GWM (I'd pick it over +2 Charisma at this point)
However, compared to the single class hexblade who now has 3 level 5 slots, a level 6 spell from mystic arcanum, up to level 5 spells, Lifedrinker and Agonizing Blast and Armor of Hexes, I'd personally say things are comparable enough. I'd lean toward them being a little more in the pure warlocks favor here. Though I think that level 9-10 probably favor your multiclass version just a bit.

Continuing on in the progression i'd say pure warlock is ultimately going to overtake the multiclass version though. Gaining Forcecage at level 13. Gaining Master of Hexes to keep moving your Hexblade's curse around at level 14. Ability to cast Invisibility at-will via new invocation at 18. Ability to cast levitate at will with an invocation. Gaining Foresight and an additional 5th level slot at 17.
 
Last edited:

Adb0782

Explorer
To critique:
  • Your level 5 is going to suck.
  • One thing I dislike about your summon fey darkness plan is that it's turn is immediately after yours. So you won't normally gain advantage till round 2. If you weren't able to precast the fey you'll be missing out on your first round of attacks as well. Fights don't usually last too many rounds. 4ish rounds is a good estimate.
  • Reaction attacks aren't reliable - some encounters you may get 1 every round and some you may not get one at all due to the trigger never occuring. Meaning the battlemaster manuevers may go to waste more often than you hope. Also your reaction shield spells that you want the sorcerer for somewhat compete with that as well.
  • You are completely unfocused on mobility - which is huge for a melee character. Using misty step to close in the times you can't reach an enemy is probably a much better use of spare level 2 slots than spiritual weapon
  • The lack of wisdom save proficiency is really going to hurt.
  • You seem to have no focus for the character - you want it all and to fill out every action type instead of enhancing the ones you are already using - or at lesat weighing whether increased focus on your current actions may payoff more than gaining other action types.

Positives:
  • Any combo that can grant advantage while using elven accuracy and GWM is solid.
  • Strong Damage
  • Not solely focused on offense
A Fresh Take:
Let's start looking at what a single class hexblade might look like,
Level 5
  • Thirsting Blade Invocation, Devil's Sight Invocation, Fiendish Vigor Invocation.
  • Important Combat Spells - Summon Fey. Hex/Spirit (for when the action cost of summon fey seems to high). Misty Step/Thunderstep. Armor of Agathys.
  • ASI = Resilient Con - For con save proficiency. (Alternate version might trade Fiendish Vigor Invocation for Eldritch Mind and Resilient Con for Elven Accuracy - the reason I didn't was because I'm a little more concerned with survivability than offense)
*Advantage from Summon Fey + Devil's Sight Combo is still really strong even without Elven Accuracy.


Level 8
  • Spell slot levels continue to improve. (Summon Fey is now always cast in a level 4 slot - meaning it gets 2 attacks as well).
  • 1 additional invocation (probably for eldritch mind).
  • ASI = Elven Accuracy
  • Accursed Specter (minor damage boost but otherwise free damage and has a decent attack bonus due to gaining your charisma bonus to it's attacks. If attacked it can soak a few hits due to it's resistance to most damage types).


Level 12
  • You've gained 2 more invocations. 1 of which is Lifedrinker (+5 damage on each attack - yay). Possibly do agonizing blast for when you absolutely can't reach an enemy in melee.
  • 3 slots now instead of 2, all level 5.
  • 1 level 6 spell.
  • ASI = GWM. Having a consistent source of Advantage with Elven Accuracy will make this better than +2 Cha IMO.
  • Armor of Hexes - Really Strong but limited uses.


The question is how does your mutliclass version compare at various levels. At level 5 you are missing out on too much. But I think we know level 5 will be rough.

By level 8 you will look something like
  • Invocations. Thirsting Blade, Eldritch Mind, Fiendish Vigor (I'm assuming you get a magic weapon by level 8)
  • Spells. You'll have an additional 3 level 1 slots (mostly for shield). However, you won't be able to cast summon fey at 4th level and you won't have any situational 4th level spells like banishment or dimension door.
  • You'll have metamagic but limited sorcery points. Extend Spell or quicken spell for Summon Fey does sound very useful though.
  • You won't have the accursed Specter.
By level 12 you will look something like
  • Same invocations as before
  • 1 additional level 2 slot than before
  • 1 more sorcery point than before
  • +Action Surge (huge addition)
  • +3 battlemaster manuever and 4 superiority dice (manuevers probably riposte, brace and Precision)
  • +GWM (I'd pick it over +2 Charisma at this point)
However, compared to the single class hexblade who now has 3 level 5 slots, a level 6 spell from mystic arcanum, up to level 5 spells, Lifedrinker and Agonizing Blast and Armor of Hexes, I'd personally say things are comparable enough. I'd lean toward them being a little more in the pure warlocks favor here. Though I think that level 9-10 probably favor your multiclass version just a bit.

Continuing on in the progression i'd say pure warlock is ultimately going to overtake the multiclass version though. Gaining Forcecage at level 13. Gaining Master of Hexes to keep moving your Hexblade's curse around at level 14. Ability to cast Invisibility at-will via new invocation at 18. Ability to cast levitate at will with an invocation. Gaining Foresight and an additional 5th level slot at 17.
The analysis seem extremely good to me, so really thanks, but about the critics there are something else to consider also:

  • 5th lv is going to be bad, thats for sure true and i don't think there is a way to mitigate it.
  • Summon Fey yea, have that problem about the first round, but it's a spell i would like to precast also becouse the duration is very good, when it's not possible to precast it Hex is going to get its place i suppose, or protection from evil and good when it's worth alternated with intelellect fortress (depends what kind of enemies you are fronting), so you always have a kinda long concentration spell to quicken if summon fey is not precasted.
  • Reaction attacks aren't reliable, true, no character have a guaranteed reaction attack i think, but you get 3 manuvers, not only reaction manuvers, one would probably be one between Brace and Riposte (for reactions), one between Menacing attack and Trip attack (for when you are without the Fey and so you need probably advantage, even if playing like me with flanking rules mitigate a bit that need, but frightned and prone, till when you get things that can't be frightened or can't go prone, are anyway always good conditions to play with. Edit: getting manuvers so late it's probably give up trip and menacing for get other reaction), and precision attack for GWM, plus you have 4 superiority dice that recharges at short rest, it mean in a day you normally have 12 manuvers rounds + 4 manuvers round more if you use Catnap, 16 manuver's rounds, if you devide it for 6 encounters in a day it's almost 3 manuvers round in every encounter (considering in minor fights you won't use manuvers, probably 3 round every encounter with manuvers it's right). Now i assumed fight of 5 rounds and it's already good use manuvers 60% of times, but if they would be fights of 4 rounds this get just better as i can use manuvers for the 90% of rounds all day. It's not a guaranted reaction attack every turn, but it's a huge boost to damage.
  • Yea, i didn't focus on mobility becouse i would like it to be in melee almost always, but already choosing Wood Elf i get a boost to mobility for free, now using Tasha's custom origin it's much easier to MC.
  • It have Wis saves as the build start with 1 lv of Fighter, it use medium armors just for don't have to waste a 15 in Str.

True anyway that with EA it's probably better get first GWM than +2 Cha, and true also that once getting things like Force Cage that are envaluable it's hard to make better with a MC, but this is a problem of Multiclassing every full caster, still worst if you think what gonna lose a Wizard or a Sorcerer (especially the wizard) once they delay spells. Backing to the build, the idea to make 5 attacks, than action surge, make 2 more attacks and quicken something kinda big before all this was also very tempting at hight lv. My intent anyway was to create a melee character with some magic, that can deal consistent costant damage, while have good chance to crit and apply also some manuvers, being able to take 5 attacks in a round (of course non every round), 2 with the attack action, one with SW, one more frequent reaction than an OA with Brace, quicken (kinda few times honestly, but good for nova) and getting at least 3rd lv spells asap.

About the Hexblade, i like the class, i was thinking also to play a Hunter Ranger 3/Hexblade x, that have much less problem delaying spells and invocations (with my stats 11 str, 14 dex, 16 con, 12 int, 13 wis, 17 cha, but also with point buy its kinda easy to manage it). Horde Breaker add a possible attack without expending any action and it neither requires you to take the attack action, i didnt go deep about this, but i think there are very nasty combos to use here with Booming Blade and Green Flame Blade, however im not that happy to give up thirsting blade for probably smites, as i wouldn't like to focus on nova and also it need to start with 3 lv of Ranger.
 
Last edited:

FrogReaver

As long as i get to be the frog
The analysis seem extremely good to me, so really thanks, but about the critics there are something else to consider also:

  • 5th lv is going to be bad, thats for sure true and i don't think there is a way to mitigate it.
You can take booming blade as a cantrip which at least helps mitigate it to some degree.

  • Summon Fey yea, have that problem about the first round, but it's a spell i would like to precast also becouse the duration is very good, when it's not possible to precast it Hex is going to get its place i suppose, or protection from evil and good when it's worth alternated with intelellect fortress (depends what kind of enemies you are fronting), so you always have a kinda long concentration spell to quicken if summon fey is not precasted.
As long as you have a plan for when it can't be precasted. I think that's the more important take away.

  • Reaction attacks aren't reliable, true, no character have a guaranteed reaction attack i think, but you get 3 manuvers, not only reaction manuvers, one would probably be one between Brace and Riposte (for reactions), one between Menacing attack and Trip attack (for when you are without the Fey and so you need probably advantage, even if playing like me with flanking rules mitigate a bit that need, but frightned and prone, till when you get things that can't be frightened or can't go prone, are anyway always good conditions to play with. Edit: getting manuvers so late it's probably give up trip and menacing for get other reaction), and precision attack for GWM, plus you have 4 superiority dice that recharges at short rest, it mean in a day you normally have 12 manuvers rounds + 4 manuvers round more if you use Catnap, 16 manuver's rounds, if you devide it for 6 encounters in a day it's almost 3 manuvers round in every encounter (considering in minor fights you won't use manuvers, probably 3 round every encounter with manuvers it's right). Now i assumed fight of 5 rounds and it's already good use manuvers 60% of times, but if they would be fights of 4 rounds this get just better as i can use manuvers for the 90% of rounds all day. It's not a guaranted reaction attack every turn, but it's a huge boost to damage.
Yea, I typically love trip on melee characters but your max(str,dex) = 14. Which means the DC for the trip will be a bit lower. I suppose that's why I hadn't mentioned it, but it's probably still a solid option to take.

  • Yea, i didn't focus on mobility becouse i would like it to be in melee almost always, but already choosing Wood Elf i get a boost to mobility for free, now using Tasha's custom origin it's much easier to MC.
IMO mobility is even more important for melee than anyone else, there will be plenty of times where enemies are just a bit too far away to reach and attack. IMO the extra 5 ft movement from wood elf is solid but not enough IMO. You'll at least have spells and Eldritch Blast to fall back on if you can't reach enemies on a given turn. So your in much better shape than a melee fighter.

  • It have Wis saves as the build start with 1 lv of Fighter, it use medium armors just for don't have to waste a 15 in Str.
Fighter Grants Con saves not wis saves? And even starting fighter for the hexblade build i'd recomend medium armor. (dex is just better and you only need 14 vs 15).

True anyway that with EA it's probably better get first GWM than +2 Cha, and true also that once getting things like Force Cage that are envaluable it's hard to make better with a MC, but this is a problem of Multiclassing every full caster, still worst if you think what gonna lose a Wizard or a Sorcerer (especially the wizard) once they delay spells. Backing to the build, the idea to make 5 attacks, than action surge, make 2 more attacks and quicken something kinda big before all this was also very tempting at hight lv. My intent anyway was to create a melee character with some magic, that can deal consistent costant damage, while have good chance to crit and apply also some manuvers, being able to take 5 attacks in a round (of course non every round), 2 with the attack action, one with SW, one more frequent reaction than an OA with Brace, quicken (kinda few times honestly, but good for nova) and getting at least 3rd lv spells asap.
Yea - I mean that yours stays right with single class warlock for so long isn't a bad thing. It's actually a very good thing. Just trying to prevent misconceptions that it's necessarily more powerful as it's pretty close in power, maybe for 5-20 overall just slightly weaker (combining the level by level comparisons into a single score).

About the Hexblade, i like the class, i was thinking also to play a Hunter Ranger 3/Hexblade x, that have much less problem delaying spells and invocations (with my stats 11 str, 14 dex, 16 con, 12 int, 13 wis, 17 cha, but also with point buy its kinda easy to manage it). Horde Breaker add a possible attack without expending any action and it neither requires you to take the attack action, i didnt go deep about this, but i think there are very nasty combos to use here with Booming Blade and Green Flame Blade, however im not that happy to give up thirsting blade for probably smites, as i wouldn't like to focus on nova and also it need to start with 3 lv of Ranger.
This might interest you. But I've pieced together a pretty strong basis for a Fighter/Warlock. My version used a shield but that can be easily adapted. I designed it as a featless character, but feats can easily be added into the build.

Start as Fighter 5 (Battlemaster). Use either Str or Dex.

Start Progressing into Genie Warlock. (I acutally recomend Chain or Tome Pact instead of blade - get a familiar and use it to help grant advantage).
Level 6 - you add hex and genie prof bonus to damage on an attack.
Level 7 - you get more uses of hex and some invocations
Level 8 - You get Shadow Blade and will use it till you find a really good magical weapon to pair with Spirit Shroud.
Level 9 - ASI
Level 10 - Shadowblade Increases to 3d8 + Mod damage.

So by level 10 you are looking at doing 3d8+7 damage per attack and an additional +4 once per turn - making 2 attacks and as many reaction attacks as possible. You'll have Trip Attack, Familiar and Shadowblade itself to help with advantage. You'll have brace/riposte for reaction attacks. You can take precision to help with landing hits. After fighter 5/warlock 5 I'd suggest continuing in warlock as there's alot of damage and utility to be had with just a few more levels - your defenses should feel pretty solid with good AC due to the shield and good hp with a bit of recovery due to the fighter. Your invocations are pretty open since you don't really have to have any for damage - so can take for utility.
 
Last edited:

Adb0782

Explorer
You can take booming blade as a cantrip which at least helps mitigate it to some degree.


As long as you have a plan for when it can't be precasted. I think that's the more important take away.


Yea, I typically love trip on melee characters but your max(str,dex) = 14. Which means the DC for the trip will be a bit lower. I suppose that's why I hadn't mentioned it, but it's probably still a solid option to take.


IMO mobility is even more important for melee than anyone else, there will be plenty of times where enemies are just a bit too far away to reach and attack. IMO the extra 5 ft movement from wood elf is solid but not enough IMO. You'll at least have spells and Eldritch Blast to fall back on if you can't reach enemies on a given turn. So your in much better shape than a melee fighter.


Fighter Grants Con saves not wis saves? And even starting fighter for the hexblade build i'd recomend medium armor. (dex is just better and you only need 14 vs 15).


Yea - I mean that yours stays right with single class warlock for so long isn't a bad thing. It's actually a very good thing. Just trying to prevent misconceptions that it's necessarily more powerful as it's pretty close in power, maybe for 5-20 overall just slightly weaker (combining the level by level comparisons into a single score).


This might interest you. But I've pieced together a pretty strong basis for a Fighter/Warlock. My version used a shield but that can be easily adapted. I designed it as a featless character, but feats can easily be added into the build.

Start as Fighter 5 (Battlemaster). Use either Str or Dex.

Start Progressing into Genie Warlock. (I acutally recomend Chain or Tome Pact instead of blade - get a familiar and use it to help grant advantage).
Level 6 - you add hex and genie prof bonus to damage on an attack.
Level 7 - you get more uses of hex and some invocations
Level 8 - You get Shadow Blade and will use it till you find a really good magical weapon to pair with Spirit Shroud.
Level 9 - ASI
Level 10 - Shadowblade Increases to 3d8 + Mod damage.

So by level 10 you are looking at doing 3d8+7 damage per attack and an additional +4 once per turn - making 2 attacks and as many reaction attacks as possible. You'll have Trip Attack, Familiar and Shadowblade itself to help with advantage. You'll have brace/riposte for reaction attacks. You can take precision to help with landing hits. After fighter 5/warlock 5 I'd suggest continuing in warlock as there's alot of damage and utility to be had with just a few more levels - your defenses should feel pretty solid with good AC due to the shield and good hp with a bit of recovery due to the fighter. Your invocations are pretty open since you don't really have to have any for damage - so can take for utility.
I don't know why i remebered fighter grants con and wis saves, while it grants con and str saves lol. Thinking about this i would probably start with HB for get WIS saves as eldricht mind already work well for CON saves.

About the BM/HB it was something i was considering also. The main problem is the very few slots, 2/3 short rest slots mean 7/11 slots a day if you use catnap (one slot is for catnap indeed), 6 are for shadow blade (one for fight at least) and the rest it's not enough neither for the shield spell i suppose, however using a shield help you with keeping higher base AC. For the patron im agree with you that without any need of thirsting blade the chain and the tome are better, chain give you a very nice familiar, fantastic for scounting and i imagine there is some solid combo with some invocation, but i never went so deep into it so i don't know so much. Tome gives us in practice almost all the rituals, giving much more versatility and out of combat use of magic, while both grants familiar for advantage on one attack.
The invocations are kinda open but you need warcaster as feat if yuo want to use a shield (or use a bonus action to make the SB reappear in your hand after you had dropped it), also book of ancient secret is kinda mandatory if you choose tome, clock of flies can fill the bonus action but probably the damage is already enough and maybe the "hex invocations" work better for fix bonus action when you have the hex curse active, investment of the chain and gift of the ever living one also seem nice if we choose chain, Trickster's escape as well is nice, freedom of movement without a slot once a day it would be gold if we could pick something like erupting earth, but i dont think warlock have access to any spell without concentration for create difficult terrain (i can be wrong about this) and probably slots would be not enough, maybe undying servitude with animate dead it's a more solid choice (except we have someone in the party casting those kind of spells).

PS delaying extra attack BM 3/HB x grants you all the arcanums and faster spell and slots progression, maybe it's worth delaying it 3 lv and get thirsting blade at lv 8 character, considering that Booming Blade and GFB can help you that couple lv's and also that the Genie additional damage apply just one time for turn, but of course we need to get pact of blade here if we don't wanna stay with only 1 attack for attack action and it's also thinking about all this that i was considering also Hunter 3/HB x over fighter. It lose action surge and manuvers, but it gains enough slots and a possible attack without use any actions, losing some damage that probably can be filled somehow for more slots.
 
Last edited:

FrogReaver

As long as i get to be the frog
I don't know why i remebered fighter grants con and wis saves, while it grants con and str saves lol. Thinking about this i would probably start with HB for get WIS saves as eldricht mind already work well for CON saves.
I can see that, however that will leave you a 12.25% chance of losing concentration per each hit. You'll keep your spells up most the time but occasionally drop them. It'll really suck when it happens.

Add on con save proficiency with Eldritch Mind and you get down to a 4% chance of losing concentration per each hit (and it will improve a bit as proficiency bonus increases). To me that means you would still want resilient con.

About the BM/HB it was something i was considering also. The main problem is the very few slots, 2/3 short rest slots mean 7/11 slots a day if you use catnap (one slot is for catnap indeed), 6 are for shadow blade (one for fight at least) and the rest it's not enough neither for the shield spell i suppose, however using a shield help you with keeping higher base AC.
IMO, if you have a shield and the higher hp from fighter and some fighter levels for 2nd wind, you probably won't really need to use the shield spell.


For the patron im agree with you that without any need of thirsting blade the chain and the tome are better, chain give you a very nice familiar, fantastic for scounting and i imagine there is some solid combo with some invocation, but i never went so deep into it so i don't know so much. Tome gives us in practice almost all the rituals, giving much more versatility and out of combat use of magic, while both grants familiar for advantage on one attack.
I decided to go tome with my last warlock over chain. I don't think I've used any of my rituals even once yet. Though the extra cantrips have been great.

The invocations are kinda open but you need warcaster as feat if yuo want to use a shield (or use a bonus action to make the SB reappear in your hand after you had dropped it),
I'm not understanding this. You don't need somatic and verbal components to make it reappear. Only to cast and you'll have a free hand when you do so.

also book of ancient secret is kinda mandatory if you choose tome, clock of flies can fill the bonus action but probably the damage is already enough and maybe the "hex invocations" work better for fix bonus action when you have the hex curse active, investment of the chain and gift of the ever living one also seem nice if we choose chain,
Agree, you'll want the invocation corresponding to chain/tome pact.

Trickster's escape as well is nice, freedom of movement without a slot once a day it would be gold if we could pick something like erupting earth, but i dont think warlock have access to any spell without concentration for create difficult terrain (i can be wrong about this) and probably slots would be not enough, maybe undying servitude with animate dead it's a more solid choice (except we have someone in the party casting those kind of spells).

PS delaying extra attack BM 3/HB x grants you all the arcanums and faster spell and slots progression, maybe it's worth delaying it 3 lv and get thirsting blade at lv 8 character, considering that Booming Blade and GFB can help you that couple lv's and also that the Genie additional damage apply just one time for turn, but of course we need to get pact of blade here if we don't wanna stay with only 1 attack for attack action
Delating extra attack 3 levels isn't worth it IMO.

and it's also thinking about all this that i was considering also Hunter 3/HB x over fighter. It lose action surge and manuvers, but it gains enough slots and a possible attack without use any actions, losing some damage that probably can be filled somehow for more slots.
Not seeing that one. You'be be better off doing something like hexblade + swords bard over that IMO.
 

Adb0782

Explorer
I can see that, however that will leave you a 12.25% chance of losing concentration per each hit. You'll keep your spells up most the time but occasionally drop them. It'll really suck when it happens.
Well, at this point can be a good idea start with fighter, get con saves and take later eldricht mind and resilient (wis), fighter 6 would give also other asi, so i suppose it's not too difficult to get it.

IMO, if you have a shield and the higher hp from fighter and some fighter levels for 2nd wind, you probably won't really need to use the shield spell.
You are probably right, with a shield +1 and an armor +1 it already get to 22 base AC (magic items +1 are kinda common in our campaign, much more less common are the +2 magic items and indeed "rare" items), even second wind is one for short rest it shouldn't be hitted that often.

I decided to go tome with my last warlock over chain. I don't think I've used any of my rituals even once yet. Though the extra cantrips have been great.
A pact of tome without using rituals make me sad lol, there are many rituals kinda easy and useful to use over find familiar, im thinking about comprehend lenguages, alarm, detect magic, identify, even silence is a ritual (however it normally have a better effect if casted with one action), leomund tiny hut it's other great spell, phantom steed is fantastic (giving you 100 ft speed for one hour, for free lol), later on rary's telepathic bond is very cool, im not understanding why you never used any of this spells that are in practice for free as they won't cost you anything else than 10 minutes to cast them, many have long duration and all are normally used out of combat (except silence). Cantrips are nice, but as it want to use the attack action mostly of times i think i would be use them less than rituals (but maybe i would choose minor illusion that is very useful for obscure line of sights and guidance that is a fantastic out of combat cantrip, as control flames or any cantrip that can help with creating dim light or darkness, in this way i think i would use cantrips more often).

I'm not understanding this. You don't need somatic and verbal components to make it reappear. Only to cast and you'll have a free hand when you do so.
I probably writed it wrong: you don't have pact weapon and even if, i suppose Shadow Blade RAW don't qualify as pact weapon (and thinking about it im considering the fact that probably you can't use SB with Cha at all, or well, You can use hex warrior with Shadow Blade, but the feature requires that you touch the weapon after you finish a long rest. This would require the warlock to cast it and to use it, which expends a spell slot. This benefit would last until the next long rest, at which point it would have to be repeated to keep the effect, so in practice use SB with Cha would burn a slot every day if i readed the RAW correctly, but can be readed also as hex warrior apply to only THAT shadow blade for only one minute, and so in practice you would never be able to use SB with Cha. I dont know which is the interpretation used on AL, but RAW both seem correct to me, but both, especially the second one, gives us a huge problem with the spell, making it underpowered compared with hex or summon fey), this mean that with a shield and a shadow blade you can't cast almost any other spell or cantrip, unless you get warcaster, or you use a bonus action to get back the shadow blade after cast the spell. In this way we need Bonus action for hex curse, second wind, cast and reget the SB and maybe hex invocations, + some manuvers if we choose manuvers that involve a bonus action, maybe it's too much for think to use magic in combat over SB till really hight lv's. I don't know, SB is a spell with hight potential, but wherever i tryed to put it it always gave me some problems with action economy, the best use i found of the spell is on Bladesinger 13/Arcane trickster 7 (or 11/9 for a more thematic character), but even so you very often gonna use canning action only on the 3rd turn.
 
Last edited:

Adb0782

Explorer
Backing to the previus build, probably it work better without getting any fighter lv.

HB 5/DS 4/HB x it's probably already ok.

Getting asi's: elven accuracy, GWM, Sentinel, for lv 12 it have all this, with 18 Cha true, but that shouldn't hurt so much with elven accuracy. He have slots, he have SW, he have easy reaction attack, he can use the shield spell and if we really want to get back the damage from superiority die he can get smites just for some nice crit. Unluckly it lose CON saves, but it still have advantage from eldricht mind and the 2 times a day +2d4 from DS, and he get WIS saves that are anyway needed. At lv 12 maybe can be more convenient to get resilient (con) instead than sentinel? Im not sure about it becouse with 16 con already the +1 is useless, however the proficiency would be really appreciate anyway.

PS without fighter it lose blind figthing style, so devil's sight would really help, but at lv 5 we need eldricht mind, we need improved pact weapon if we want use a two handed weapon and we need thirsting blade, this can be a serius problem for the summon fey combo for grant advantage, as we have to delay an invocation till lv 11, probably the best option we have is delay improved pact weapon to lv 11 and get GWM at lv 12.
 
Last edited:

FrogReaver

As long as i get to be the frog
Backing to the previus build, probably it work better without getting any fighter lv.

HB 5/DS 4/HB x it's probably already ok.
I'd had that same thought.

Getting asi's: elven accuracy, GWM, Sentinel, for lv 12 it have all this, with 18 Cha true, but that shouldn't hurt so much with elven accuracy. He have slots, he have SW, he have easy reaction attack,
For a more defensive version I really like this. Keep in mind enemies will also often have disadvantage to hit you. Slots for shield is great. I think sentinel is a good move because your fey has pretty low hp and only moderate AC. So this will help keep it alive.

he can use the shield spell and if we really want to get back the damage from superiority die he can get smites just for some nice crit.
I don't think you'll have enough slots to worry about smiting on a crit. At least not till way later. So while cool, it's not something i'd worry about. Though building a warlock around this idea could be cool.

Unluckly it lose CON saves, but it still have advantage from eldricht mind and the 2 times a day +2d4 from DS, and he get WIS saves that are anyway needed. At lv 12 maybe can be more convenient to get resilient (con) instead than sentinel?
I'd do sentinel. Your fey is too low of hp to risk it being attacked very much. Sentinel can at least serve as a deterrent. Against some enemies it could die in 1-2 hits and it would be hit pretty often. Which really should be an overall criticism of build.

Im not sure about it becouse with 16 con already the +1 is useless, however the proficiency would be really appreciate anyway.

PS without fighter it lose blind figthing style, so devil's sight would really help, but at lv 5 we need eldricht mind, we need improved pact weapon if we want use a two handed weapon and we need thirsting blade, this can be a serius problem for the summon fey combo for grant advantage, as we have to delay an invocation till lv 11, probably the best option we have is delay improved pact weapon to lv 11 and get GWM at lv 12.
Very good point. Starting hexblade 8 could solve that problem. As you'd get your 4th invocation. Also would grant summon fey the extra attack some more hp and ac. I mean your primary tactic gives enemies disadvantage to hit you, so delaying shield a bit longer seems okay IMO.
 
Last edited:

Adb0782

Explorer
For a more defensive version I really like this. Keep in mind enemies will also often have disadvantage to hit you. Slots for shield is great. I think sentinel is a good move because your fey has pretty low hp and only moderate AC. So this will help keep it alive.
I didn't think it could work also to keep the fey alive but yea, if we add this aspect i think it's better than resilient-
I don't think you'll have enough slots to worry about smiting on a crit. At least not till way later. So while cool, it's not something i'd worry about. Though building a warlock around this idea could be cool.
I wasn't really serius about it, it's kinda overkilling probably :p but on higher levels can be cool.
Very good point. Starting hexblade 8 could solve that problem. As you'd get your 4th invocation. Also would grant summon fey the extra attack some more hp and ac. I mean your primary tactic gives enemies disadvantage to hit you, so delaying shield a bit longer seems okay IMO.
Yea, till when it don't fight things with blindsight it gonna work, but once it start to meet many enemies that don't rely on sight for attacks that combo need to be changed with something else and having no familiar it would be difficult also to get advantage (but using the flanking rule this would be easier), Protection from evil and good give disadvantage to almost everything not relying on sight for attacks, so it can be a good alternative, however it last only 10 minutes regardless which slot you gonna use. Intellect fortress against casters it's very good and the duration is enough long...the real thing it seem to miss is a font of advantage against things not relying on sight over flanking, but maybe it's not something to be too worry about using some party tactics.
Other option is to use hex more often, as it have lots of attacks anyway, but this can be done better once being able to use the shield spell more frequently, as they not gonna have disadvantage to hit, haste would be nice too due the +2 AC and again other attack withou using any kind of action, unluckly it last only one minute.
I'd do sentinel. Your fey is too low of hp to risk it being attacked very much. Sentinel can at least serve as a deterrent. Against some enemies it could die in 1-2 hits and it would be hit pretty often. Which really should be an overall criticism of build.
Yep, it can be a problem, i was also thinking to get warding bond for protect it, at cost of a slot and half the damage it take i protect it enough well, but im not sure when it start to be worth to spend a slot for it, probably i can fill it feeling the need while playing it.
 
Last edited:

FrogReaver

As long as i get to be the frog
Yep, it can be a problem, i was also thinking to get warding bond for protect it, at cost of a slot and half the damage it take i protect it enough well, but im not sure when it start to be worth to spend a slot for it, probably i can fill it feeling the need while playing it.
Warding bond only lasts 1 hour for a level 2 slot. I think it's too expensive to rely on as a way to increase fey's survivability.
 

Level Up!

An Advertisement

Advertisement4

Top