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<blockquote data-quote="Neonchameleon" data-source="post: 9156918" data-attributes="member: 87792">And what I offered was practical and feasible and even relatively straightfoward.&nbsp; You just don't like it because it doesn't fit one of your then-unstated assumptions.If you want to do it your way you have to start by fixing the school of necromancy being a half-school. You need to add spells. Remember there are no fifth level necromancy spells wizards can cast in the entire PHB. There are only two fourth level necromancy spells in the entire game - and Shadow of Moil is Warlock-exclusive. And you've basically no out of combat utility in Necromancy until you get third level spells. You've a zap cantrip, combat debuffs, and False Life for temp hp as a wizard ... and that's it. Even when you look in Xanathar's and Tasha's.This means that at a bare minimum to fix the Necromancer if we arbitrarily have to keep them in the wizard class we need to create two utility first level spells, two utility second level spells, and two fourth level spells, all within the school of necromancy, all of which have to be entirely new to D&amp;D 5e (plus to pull in some fifth level spells from Xanathar's). Or we can do things my actually practical and feasable way that doesn't require a necromancy supplement - and allow the Necromancer sorcerer to have spells like an Unseen Servant variant that uses spirits that doesn't clog up the page count to produce an almost duplicate effect.So we have a bad subclass based on a school that is not fit for purpose and you want us to think inside the box. If the box contained the answers Crawford would have managed it.</blockquote>

[QUOTE="Neonchameleon, post: 9156918, member: 87792"] And what I offered was practical and feasible and even relatively straightfoward. You just don't like it because it doesn't fit one of your then-unstated assumptions. If you want to do it your way you have to start by fixing the school of necromancy being a half-school. You need to add spells. Remember there are no fifth level necromancy spells wizards can cast in the entire PHB. There are only two fourth level necromancy spells in the entire game - and Shadow of Moil is Warlock-exclusive. And you've basically no out of combat utility in Necromancy until you get third level spells. You've a zap cantrip, combat debuffs, and False Life for temp hp as a wizard ... and that's it. Even when you look in Xanathar's and Tasha's. This means that at a bare minimum to fix the Necromancer if we arbitrarily have to keep them in the wizard class we need to create two utility first level spells, two utility second level spells, and two fourth level spells, all within the school of necromancy, all of which have to be entirely new to D&D 5e (plus to pull in some fifth level spells from Xanathar's). Or we can do things my actually practical and feasable way that doesn't require a necromancy supplement - and allow the Necromancer [I]sorcerer[/I] to have spells like an Unseen Servant variant that uses spirits that doesn't clog up the page count to produce an almost duplicate effect. So we have a bad subclass based on a school that is not fit for purpose and you want us to think inside the box. [I]If the box contained the answers Crawford would have managed it.[/I] [/QUOTE]

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