Actions while mounted.

[TessarrianDM]

If a character is mounted, do the character and mount get to act seperately? For example, can a character take a move action to draw a weapon and then make an attack with it while the mount makes a move and attack? If not, how do the actions of one affect what the other is able to do? Can they act on different initiative turns, or must their actions occur in the same initiative order? We have been doing more outdoor adventuring lately, and the PC's are beginning to pay more attention to fighting while mounted. Do the mounts and the riders both get to take a full round's worth of actions?

Recently occuring scenario:

The party Healer is mounted on her unicorn. She rolled a 7 for her initiative. The unicorn rolled a 16. A fellow party member 35' away is in melee, and in trouble (down to single digit hit points). She wants to have her unicorn move in and attack the opponent with its horn while she draws a wand of cure critical wounds and heals the character while she remains mounted.

A. Can she do this.
B. Do all actions occur in the same initiative turn? If so, which initiative?
C. Would the healer need to make a DC 20 Ride check to "control mount in battle" or a DC 10 Ride check to "fight with warhorse"? How about an attack roll to "hit" her ally with the wand?

Also, does a mounted character retain their Dex bonus to AC and Reflex saves, or do they use the mount's?

 

[JustinA]

Recently occuring scenario:

The party Healer is mounted on her unicorn. She rolled a 7 for her initiative. The unicorn rolled a 16. A fellow party member 35' away is in melee, and in trouble (down to single digit hit points). She wants to have her unicorn move in and attack the opponent with its horn while she draws a wand of cure critical wounds and heals the character while she remains mounted.

A. Can she do this.
B. Do all actions occur in the same initiative turn? If so, which initiative?
C. Would the healer need to make a DC 20 Ride check to "control mount in battle" or a DC 10 Ride check to "fight with warhorse"? How about an attack roll to "hit" her ally with the wand?

Also, does a mounted character retain their Dex bonus to AC and Reflex saves, or do they use the mount's?

A. Yes.

B. Yes. The rider's initiative is used. (In fact, under RAW, the mount's initiative should not be rolled.)

C. By RAW, this is unclear. I would argue that one needs to look at the entry for the Pegasus, which reads (in part): "A pegasus can fight while carrying a rider, but the rider cannot also attack unless he or she succeeds on a Ride check." This suggests that intelligent mounts do not need to be controlled, which makes sense. Using a unicorn as a mount is not described in the MM, so you're left utterly without guidance there.

D. A mounted character retains their Dex bonus. They do not use the mount's.

Dream Machine Productions will be releasing Rule Supplement 1: Mounted Combat within the week. The supplement standardizes the mounted combat rules and extends them to include intelligent mounts; multiple riders; mounts of different sizes; rules for burrowing, climbing, flying, and swimming mounts; warpacks; jousting; and a bunch of other stuff.

These are the rules for intelligent mounts in that supplement:

Intelligent Mounts​

Intelligent mounts - such as centaurs, dragons, or unicorns - generally act like normal combatants. When mounted, however, both they and their riders gain the benefits and penalties of mounted combatants. The following special rules apply to intelligent mounts.

Any mount with an intelligence of 3 or higher is considered an intelligent mount.

TRAINING INTELLIGENT MOUNTS
Even intelligent mounts must receive training in order to learn how to cooperate effectively with riders on the battlefield. This training does not require the mount to take ranks in any skill or gain any feat, but it does require at least six weeks of training. The would-be mount must spend at least 3 hours per day working towards the completion of this training. If the training is interrupted, the mount must begin again from scratch.

An untrained intelligent mount has problems coordinating their actions with their rider. Both the untrained mount and the rider suffer a -2 penalty to attack rolls and skill checks involving movement (such as Climb or Move Silently). In addition, the mount is automatically considered to be carrying a heavy load. Paladin's mounts, animal companions, awakened animals, and similar creatures which were war-trained before being awakened do not need to be trained in this way.

TAKING ACTION
Initiative: An intelligent mount and rider both roll for initiative normally, taking their actions simultaneously on whichever initiative result is lower. (In effect, either the mount or the rider delays their action for the other.)

Independent Action: An intelligent mount can take action without direction from their rider. As a result, the rider of an intelligent mount does not need to make a Ride check in order to guide a mount with their knees or to take actions other than movement.

Attacking: An intelligent mount can attack normally and without direction, but for the rider to attack at the same time requires a successful Ride check (DC 10).

SHARING FEATS AND SPECIAL ABILITIES
Intelligent mounts, like their riders, may possess feats. The benefits of these feats cannot be shared, with the following exceptions:

Movement: A mount can take advantage of feats and special abilities that allow them additional or unusual movement (such as Run or Spring Attack). As with any other movement, the rider is automatically carried with the mount. The rider does not, however, benefit from any other advantages of the feat or special ability unless they also possess the feat or special ability.

Mounted Combat Feats: Feats dealing with mounted combat frequently benefit both the rider and his mount. (In the PHB, these feats include Mounted Archery, Mounted Combat, Ride-By Attack, Spirited Charge, and Trample.) If the rider has these feats, they benefit an intelligent mount normally.

Justin Alexander
http://www.thealexandrian.net

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

JustinA, I will be looking for that supplement.. it sounds useful!

TessarrianDM, I use some basic guidelines when handling mounted combat.

Controlled mount:
- Rider must make a ride check to control the mount per the Ride skill
- both act on riders initiative

Uncontrolled mount:
- Individual intiatives, mount moves when it wants to and the Rider has to ready actions to hit desired enemy/ally
- Rider must succeed at a Ride check as a Move action. Failure results in losing all actions for the round


As to C, it is relatively clear assuming the Rider is in control of the mount. Unless the unicorn is trained for War.. you are looking at a DC 20 check. And no, I would require a touch attack action, but not an attack roll. Unless the target wants to actively avoid

Side note, If the pegasus is not trained for battle, not only is the Ride check a DC 20, but it is a Move action as well.. meaning the Healer could only get there and draw the wand.. not actually use it

 

[nittanytbone]

There is a DMG sidebar about sentient mounts and initiative. Check page 22.

 

[JustinA]

JustinA, I will be looking for that supplement.. it sounds useful!

This has now been released, you or anyone else is still interested (see my .sig).

Justin Alexander
Dream Machine Productions
http://www.thealexandrian.net

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

My order is in

I prefer hard-copy, so it will be a while before I can comment on the book...

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

Got the book not too long ago and have done a couple read throughs.

I like the material and concept, having *every* rule related to the task all in one place is very cool.

I also liked the extrapolation done for the different mode of movement, and the Jousting rules made sense.

I haven't had time to red-pen through the Feats, but at first blush there are some that are pointless {'Rider's Vengeance', benefit is cool, but not common enough to waste the feat} and others that have major twinkage capability {Inspired Special Mount and Special Mount training would be two Feats any Paladin would take as soon as possible}
Then there is the feat that every Druid and Ranger has? {Woodland Rider, any character with Woodland Stride class ability is considered to have taken this feat...}

I only saw a couple of rules oddities, I think the "Trainer of the Empty Mind" feat should not be tied different Pre-requisites, using either Knowledge for constructs of undead instead. It doesn't make sense, to me, that because you are really good at training animals you can overcome the lack of a mind to train....

The other oddity,Page 21 sidebar references the "Fly check" as "See Rules Supplement 2: Flight" ...which you have not published yet ?



Anyway, solid book to add to my collection, I will share it with my two players who currently have mounted PC's and see what they think.