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Message: <blockquote data-quote="ObsidianCrane" data-source="post: 4918904" data-attributes="member: 54918">I brought this up at my regular game and one of my players made an astute observation; as nothing in the power says you get to change the rules for how to determine a hit you still miss, and thus you "score a crit" but no target takes the damage. Congratulations.To prove the power makes the roll a hit you must show specific text that makes it an exception to the basic hit, miss, automatic hit, automatic miss rules, along with the Precision rule.Hmm this harks back to some things that were bothering me at the start of the thread.A single d20 roll improves by 5% by every value you can crit on (20 = 5%, 19-20 10% etc), but the Avenger is very different to that.An Avenger who crits on a 20 does so  9.75% of the time.An Avenger who crits on a 19-20 does so 19% of the time.An Avenger who crits on an 18-20 does so a huge 27.75% of the time. This is why the Dagger Master PP is so appealing for Avenger builds.When you Crit on Doubles the values look different however.A crit on any non-(1,1) double or a 20 gets you a 14.25% chance of a crit.A crit on say a 11 or better hit that is a double or 20 gets you only a 12% chance of a crit.If you get a way to crit on 19-20 or any non-(1,1) double your chance of a crit jumps to 23.25%!If you get a way to crit on a 19-20 or any non-(1,1) and still need an 11 or better to hit to get your rolled a double crit it comes in at 21%So the more conservative reading gets you a better a crit chance than simply having a 19-20 for a non-Avenger, but worse than if you are an avenger with a 19-20. But if you grab a jagged weapon or take Heavy Blade Mastery at Epic the Ardent Avenger is only eclipsed in Cirt % by the Dagger Master avenger, and the reality is the difference in damage output on those crits is where the two builds balance.</blockquote>

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