AEG's Empires

[Nine Hands]

Hmmm, sounds pretty good.

I was sort of wary about this, because a lot of AEG one word title books are nothing more than a grab bag of stuff vaguely related to that title.

I had the same feeling when I first read the title, but I like Mike's work and I'll definately be picking this up, esp if it integrates well with D&D -- Dynasties and Demogouges

 

[d20Dwarf]

Hmmm, sounds pretty good.

I was sort of wary about this, because a lot of AEG one word title books are nothing more than a grab bag of stuff vaguely related to that title.

Well, this one is a single author book, so it's less likely to fall into that trap. I'm desperately looking for a reason not to pick up this book.

 

[Utrecht]

I paged through the book last Friday at my FLGS - felt that it was overpriced for what you got.

Again, this is a five minute flip through review (with a couple of days to muddle things up)

Cost is the standard AEG $24.95 cost - I do not remember the page count - but it felt thin - about 2/3 the normal size of an AEG book.

The first part of the book seemed to be the best - figuring out what the income of a nation was - basically things were handled in an "units" Gold Units, Wood Units, etc.... Then to build strategic assests like barracks, forts, mines, etc. cost these units.

Next was a description of armies troop types - I was dissapointed with this section - Each of the various fantastic troop types - like skeletons, goblins etc had thier Monster manual stats reprinted.... waste of space IMO

Next there was a section on running a country/empire and an assosciated campaigns - this seemed to be pretty good.

There is likely more - but I do not remember it.

So, overall, I wold give it 2 out of 5 stars - not necessarily because the content is bad - but because the page count value does not seem to be there.

 

[Davelozzi]

I do not remember the page count - but it felt thin - about 2/3 the normal size of an AEG book.

It's 128 pages.

I also gave it a quick flip through at the store but was more impressed than you were. My interest level is very high for this book, but because of the direction of my current campaign, I dont see it having any immediate use for my game. I'm hoping to pick it up when funds allow, but opted to pick up African Alliance (new Spycraft/SFA book) that day instead.

 

[Piratecat]

So, overall, I wold give it 2 out of 5 stars - not necessarily because the content is bad - but because the page count value does not seem to be there.

No offense (and I haven't seen Empires yet), but that strikes me as a horrible reason to rate a book poorly. Giving something 2 out of 5 stars when you have no real idea of the content is misleading and pretty much useless. Yes, even if you explain your rationale, as you did very clearly.

The problem, of course, is that people tend to remember the "stars" rating and not the text that surrounded it. I think in this kind of case, you're better off just sharing your first impression and not giving it a rating at all.

 

[d20Dwarf]

No offense (and I haven't seen Empires yet), but that strikes me as a horrible reason to rate a book poorly. Giving something 2 out of 5 stars when you have no real idea of the content is misleading and pretty much useless. Yes, even if you explain your rationale, as you did very clearly.

The problem, of course, is that people tend to remember the "stars" rating and not the text that surrounded it. I think in this kind of case, you're better off just sharing your first impression and not giving it a rating at all.

I think he's just following the example of the EN World reviewers, who by placing their page count/value "analysis" at the beginning of every review have put too much of a focus on that criterion. Books are priced according to their production cost primarily, publishers don't just look at a page count and go, "oh, well, I guess it's $24.95."

Content and utility are king, not a couple of bucks here or there that makes you think a book is a bad value based on the amount of pulp between the covers.

 

[Utrecht]

No offense (and I haven't seen Empires yet), but that strikes me as a horrible reason to rate a book poorly. Giving something 2 out of 5 stars when you have no real idea of the content is misleading and pretty much useless. Yes, even if you explain your rationale, as you did very clearly.

The problem, of course, is that people tend to remember the "stars" rating and not the text that surrounded it. I think in this kind of case, you're better off just sharing your first impression and not giving it a rating at all.

None taken - and you are probably right - I should have stated something like the value of this book appears to be low - but the content (with the exception of the monster manual reprints) seems to be high. Given that - I would give it 3/5 - 2/3s of the book were very good 1/3 of the book was a waste - IMO of course

Further - for all readers - this is based off of a 5 minute page through - so take it for what it is.

If it was $10 or $15 dollars I would have picked it up - but at $25 it was a definate pass.

edit - 1/2+2/3 does not equal one..... stupid math

 

[Psion]

I think he's just following the example of the EN World reviewers, who by placing their page count/value "analysis" at the beginning of every review have put too much of a focus on that criterion. Books are priced according to their production cost primarily, publishers don't just look at a page count and go, "oh, well, I guess it's $24.95."[/b]

Not that I disagree with you about Utrecht's off-the-cuff rating. But as I am the only one who consistently notes page count vs. price, I sort of feel like you are speaking of my review style here.

That being the case, I would defend myself by saying:
1) I only ever criticize a product if it is very much below the average in page count for price. And in those cases, it deserves to be noted, even if it is not heavily worked into the final rating.
2) Even when it is noted, it is far from the predominant factor in my ratings in reviews. Utility is the number one criteria. (Note despite being the BEST value per page to date, the Twin Crowns setting only earned a 3.)

Content and utility are king, not a couple of bucks here or there that makes you think a book is a bad value based on the amount of pulp between the covers.

You say "content" is king. The thrust of my ratings in this vein, and I emphasize this in every review, is the amount of content delivered, not the amount of paper.

That said, I would agree with the general thought that one should not give something a 2/5 based on content alone unless it is REALLY out there (like, say, Digital Burn). Even a fairly thin product should earn a 5 IMO the utility and presentation are good enough (not wanting to tip my hand on future reviews, but let's just say a certain somewhat slender landscape-printed color book could be seeing a 5 from me...) But Empires is not out-there price-wise. 128 pages for $25 is entirely ordinary for the current market.

By the same token, a good price/page ratio isn't a guarantee of a good reception from me, either. The recent Slayer's Guide to Demons is a good value based on price ratio, keeping Mongoose's traditional good value of 128 pages for 20 bucks in the face of a market with climbing prices. But that book REALLY needed some art for the new demons badly, and I feel the book would have been much better if it was a dollar or two more expensive if it gave Mongoose the capital to hire some good artists.

 

[Vrylakos]

So, I bought Empire.

Overall, I'm happy with it, but as mentioned the amount of space given over to reprinting stat blocks was a bit of a disappointment and, IMO, pretty unnecessary. A single stat block used as an example of how to convert would have been enough. I'd rather have seen more troops in Empire's stat shorthand, or more discussion of the fantastic elements of warfare in the D&D paradigm.

I plan on buying Cry Havoc, though I'd be interested in hearing people compare and contrast Empire, Cry Havoc, and any other mass battle systems out there for d20...

Vrylakos