All magic is cursed…what types of mechanics make sense at the table?

[dm_fromscratch]

In a lot of ways, you could consider the downsides of the caster classes they already have as curses. Wizards and Sorcerers only get d6s for hit dice-- is that due to them not getting enough time in the gym to get healthier, or is that perhaps because they've been "cursed" to be weaker than most other normal people? It depends on how you frame the narrative to the players. Why can't they wear armor when casting spells? Is that because they just were never taught how to put armor on and wear it successfully while casting, or is it they've been "cursed" to not be able to wear any sort of protection on the battlefield? Again, it's all in how you frame the class's mechanics as part of the narrative of the world.

And then if you find the natural low-points of the caster classes are not enough for you in terms of "curses"... you could choose to go further by making some additional changes / amendments to the wizards and sorcerers so that they are unable to compensate for these hinderances that the class mechanics give them. For instance, you could say that wizards and sorcerers cannot raise their CON score above 10 so they will always be cursed to be low on hit points and perhaps you remove Mage Armor and Shield from their spell lists so that they are always cursed to be easier to hit?

In terms of balance, the game takes these possibilities of low HP and no protection spells into account-- they don't force wizards and sorcerers to raise their CON to make up for their d6 hit dice and they don't give Mage Armor and Shield to these classes for free as a repayment for not giving them any armor proficiencies. They allow for these possibilities to occur and the game is set up such that it still works for them if it does. Now granted, most players DO choose take these things on their own in order to compensate for their class shortcomings because the game lets them... but the game will still work even if you don't.

Interesting thought and brings up the question of how mechanical vs how narrative the curse needs to be. I’d ideally like a balanced approach, one that does apply some simple but unique rules that have a basis in the world’s lore so they don’t feel like they were just arbitrarily added.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

@DEFCON 1

As I was reading your post, I was headed in a certain direct…

For instance, you could say that wizards and sorcerers cannot raise their CON score above 10 so they will always be cursed to be low on hit points

…and there it is.

Similar afflictions could also hinder Str and Dex improvements. Perhaps each player chooses one stat to be so affected at the beginning.

 

[dm_fromscratch]

@DEFCON 1

As I was reading your post, I was headed in a certain direct…


…and there it is.

Similar afflictions could also hinder Str and Dex improvements. Perhaps each player chooses one stat to be so affected at the beginning.

One of the things I like about this is thinking how I might apply it to magic using enemies since the curse affects them as well. Con is definitely a tough one since it’s tied not just to HP but also spell concentration which pretty much only affects spellcasters. Still, if say a magic weapon caused a character to choose Str, Dex, or Con to drop to 10 to gain its magical properties, it might create some interesting challenges/choices for martials as well. Again we’re skirting near that grey area between risky-reward-fun and nerfy-not-fun, but there are definitely some possibilities here.

 

[Baron Opal II]

I've come across at least one system back in the day where the magician would accrue points with the casting of each spell. As long as it was kept below a certain threshold these points would slowly dissipate. If the threshold was exceeded a saving throw was made. If made there were no consequences, but the accrued points were still there. If failed, the points were removed but Something Bad Happened. You ended up with little magic every day, a moderate burst once a week, or the choice of mutation with ruination.

It might have been the Wheel of Time book...?

 

[dm_fromscratch]

I've come across at least one system back in the day where the magician would accrue points with the casting of each spell. As long as it was kept below a certain threshold these points would slowly dissipate. If the threshold was exceeded a saving throw was made. If made there were no consequences, but the accrued points were still there. If failed, the points were removed but Something Bad Happened. You ended up with little magic every day, a moderate burst once a week, or the choice of mutation with ruination.

It might have been the Wheel of Time book...?

I do like the idea of cursed magic accruing and waiting for a chance to unleash its chaos on the world, and the magic user weighing the risks of pushing past their safe limit "quota." But I hesitate in adding more things to keep track of. Maybe it could be tied to a caster's existing resource pool (eg spell slots or spell points). And thx for the ideas/leads. I'll see what I can dig up about the Wheel of Time mechanics.

 

[Wild Gazebo]

I've always liked the idea of paying a price for magic (although I rarely look at is as a curse). I think, in this world, you might want to eliminate some of the traditional classes (or at least common crunch of the classes). Don't have a wizard class, have many warrior/rogue classes with feat/skill access to magic. That makes them as tough as other warriors but they can now pay prices to use the magic.

This opens up mechanics like skill/ability checks for successes and failures. The cost of casting could be tied to ability loss, or hit point loss, or even exhaustion. It closely couples with flavor/roleplay consequences like defiling environment, personal deformations or even insanities.

Traditionally, there seems to be a slant toward more severe consequences for quick access to power and less severe toward slow thoughtful gains in strength. This is easily accommodated by the scales of cost...but I personally don't like that particular trope and find it more interesting to see how far players will sacrifice their characters for their goals.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I've come across at least one system back in the day where the magician would accrue points with the casting of each spell. As long as it was kept below a certain threshold these points would slowly dissipate.

IOW, something like a mech’s ability to dissipate heat in MechWarrior. Which, TBH, is not a bad mechanic to yoink.

I could see certain items- say…”charms”- that act as sinks for curse energy, and accelerate the dissipation process. But they could overload, releasing all that curse energy…explosively.*

Tangentially, I could also see a campaign analog of sin-eaters, who take on the curse energy in exchange for money, food and other boons.





* Note of warning: if the overload is too predictable and has too much of a delay before the charm fails catastrophically, some clever player will start using overloaded charms like grenades. Which is fine if you like that.

 

[dm_fromscratch]

I've always liked the idea of paying a price for magic (although I rarely look at is as a curse). I think, in this world, you might want to eliminate some of the traditional classes (or at least common crunch of the classes). Don't have a wizard class, have many warrior/rogue classes with feat/skill access to magic. That makes them as tough as other warriors but they can now pay prices to use the magic.

This opens up mechanics like skill/ability checks for successes and failures. The cost of casting could be tied to ability loss, or hit point loss, or even exhaustion. It closely couples with flavor/roleplay consequences like defiling environment, personal deformations or even insanities.

Traditionally, there seems to be a slant toward more severe consequences for quick access to power and less severe toward slow thoughtful gains in strength. This is easily accommodated by the scales of cost...but I personally don't like that particular trope and find it more interesting to see how far players will sacrifice their characters for their goals.

I’ve done some limiting of classes/subclasses for narrative purposes. Going full martial with magic gained by feats tho I didn’t think of. It’d be tough to put that in now, but maybe in an earlier timeline campaign, like right after the curse hit the world…

As far as “the quick and easy path leads to the dark side” I’d subscribe to that in some settings where it’s a dominant theme but the cursed lands isn’t quite that. Still, scaling repercussions is a useful tool. Just need to decide on what dials shift them them up or down.

 

[dm_fromscratch]

IOW, something like a mech’s ability to dissipate heat in MechWarrior. Which, TBH, is not a bad mechanic to yoink.

I could see certain items- say…”charms”- that act as sinks for curse energy, and accelerate the dissipation process. But they could overload, releasing all that curse energy…explosively.*

Tangentially, I could also see a campaign analog of sin-eaters, who take on the curse energy in exchange for money, food and other boons.





* Note of warning: if the overload is too predictable and has too much of a delay before the charm fails catastrophically, some clever player will start using overloaded charms like grenades. Which is fine if you like that.

In-game curse eaters and negative energy sinks could be cool. I’m also looking at meta-currency like inspiration or bennies which could be spent to redirect cursed effects.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

I’m also looking at meta-currency like inspiration or bennies which could be spent to redirect cursed effects.

Can you explain this a bit more?