Am I the only one who doesn't like the D&D Vampire? (Pointless rant, I suppose)

[Green Knight]

I got 3 beefs with the vampire. Let me go through them.

1) Slam Attack - What the hell is this? They slam into you? And how exactly is it that this drains levels out of you? I'd appreciate it if someone can explaint his to me, because I don't get it.

2) Blood Drain - Ok, draining CON points makes perfect sense. But PERMANENTLY? They can't be serious! A vampire bites you once and you NEVER recover from it? This makes no sense.

3) Vampire Spawn - Nevermind that these should be templates. But why is it you have to be 5th level or higher to become a full-fledged vampire, while anything less only makes you a Vampire Spawn? Either way, you're still under the thrall of the vampire which created you, so it really doesn't make a difference.

4) Vampire Creation - Now that I think about it, I've got FOUR beefs with the vampire. Namely that it's TO EASY to create a new vampire. You create a vampire when you kill someone with the energy drain (The aformentioned "slam" attack, which sounds as if you're slapping the levels out of people), or when you kill them through your bite, and you create either a Vampire or a Vampire Spawn. Doesn't that strike anyone else as just too easy? Wouldn't D&D worlds be running amock with vampires in that case? The only way a vampire can avoid creating a new vampire is by NOT draining their victim completely. Does that make sense to anyone?

Ah well. Just needed to get that off my chest as those 4 items really teed me off about the D&D vampire. Feel free to disparage my points all you like if you disagree. Thank you for your time.

 

[LostSoul]

I only allow energy drain through the bite attack (along with the Con drain).

I'm looking for some way of having vampires with different powers and weaknesses... as though they were a demon type unto themselves.

 

[Green Knight]

Personally I don't see the point of an Energy Drain at all, when they drain Con. The average person will be dead after 4 rounds on average (24 seconds) if a Vampire gets a good hold on them and drains them dry. Why suck out levels, too?

My problem with that is here the Con damage is permanent. Zuh? Yeah, you'd be pretty sickly for a while, but eventually you'd recover from the blood loss. I don't see why the Con damage should be permanent.

 

[Richards]

Perhaps you'd prefer a vampire variant that Sean K. Reynolds posted on his website:

http://www.seankreynolds.com/rpgfiles/monsters/fleshboundvampire.html

His "fleshbound vampire" only temporarily drains Constitution points and doesn't drain levels with a slam attack. It's more like a "Buffy" vampire than a "D&D" vampire.

Johnathan

 

[Furn_Darkside]

I have actually never met one...

Salutations,

They definitly went with the From Dusk til Dawn vampire over the classic Bela Lugosi vampire.

The few times I have used vampires- I have altered them to meet my feelings at the time, but it is not big deal the way they are now.

FD

 

[LostSoul]

Personally I don't see the point of an Energy Drain at all, when they drain Con. The average person will be dead after 4 rounds on average (24 seconds) if a Vampire gets a good hold on them and drains them dry. Why suck out levels, too?

My problem with that is here the Con damage is permanent. Zuh? Yeah, you'd be pretty sickly for a while, but eventually you'd recover from the blood loss. I don't see why the Con damage should be permanent.

I allow a Fort save to avoid the negative levels in the first place, and I don't have anything cause permanent damage. I just think permanent damage is cheesy. And I don't have Clerics in the game, so Restoration is hard to come by.

 

[ColonelHardisson]

1) Slam Attack - What the hell is this?

It would have been great if, instead, they did a Belly-to-Belly Soufflex and put you in the Camel Clutch.

Wrasslin' vampires!

 

[Furn_Darkside]

Re: Re: Am I the only one who doesn't like the D&D Vampire? (Pointless rant, I suppose)

Wrasslin' vampires!

Argh, good thing George 'The Animal' Steele is not around anymore..

FD

 

[coyote6]

1) Check out the MM, p. 7: "Slam: The creature batters opponents with an appendage, dealing bludgeoning damage."

It's not a body slam or anything like that; it's just a smack. A punch, kick, elbow, backhand, pimp slap, whatever. "Slam" is shorthand for "some kind of unarmed attack that doesn't use claws or anything, but counts as an armed attack for purposes of most rules."

It drains levels 'cause vampires are fueled by negative energy, and negative energy drains levels. That's how undead work in D&D, mostly.

2) That's the way vampires work in D&D. They drain you permanently. They do that in other game systems, too -- if you lose Essence to a Shadowrun vamp, it ain't coming back. Actually, I think that fits with at least some legends -- once you've been the victim of a vampire, you feel the effects forever.

Besides, "permanent" drain isn't. Attributes permanently lost don't recover naturally, but powerful enough magic will bring 'em back. Restoration is "only" 4th level.

3) Vampire spawn & vampires have different powers. Spawn charm rather than dominate, they don't summon animals, don't heal as fast, etc.

It could (and probably should) be a template; however, such a template would only apply to creatures of 4 HD or less, and would raise any creature with less than 4 HD to 4 HD. See, vampires, even vampire spawn, can only be so weak. Even a baby kobold would become a 4 HD creature.

4) The ease of vampire creation is true of certain vampire legends. I don't understand how any humans survived in Transylvania, if anyone killed by a vamp rises in three days. That's one thing I like about the Anne Rice/VtM/Buffy-style vamps -- they have to take action to make a vamp.

It's pretty easy to prevent most vampire victims from rising -- you just burn the bodies. "Realistically", societies afflicted with D&D vamps would probably take to cremating all of their dead. Then you'd only get new vamps in unusual circumstances (e.g., vamp guards the body, body lost, etc.)

And, actually, I notice that it says they rise "1d4 days after burial [emphasis added]". So if there's no burial, there's no rising -- which will cut out the corpses dropped in the wilderness and such.

Me, I'm not real fond of the D&D vampire either -- but I use it in D&D, 'cause, well, it's part of the game. However, you can create alternates. Sean Reynolds created a more physical vamp, with no energy drain, no slam attack, no spell-like abilities, & its bite does temporary Con damage; check it out. It even gives an ECL modifier, so you can have PC vamps!

 

[mythusmage]

Like vampires?

You don't likevampires. You fear vampires, you dread vampires, you hate vampires with a passion deep and abiding. You never likevampires.

They nasty folks, they is.

As to the permanent Con loss. Think of it as a curse. So long as the vampire "lives" the victim does not recover the loss. To recover you must destroy the beast. Makes dealing with them harder and their destruction more imperative.

If you must go hunting vampires, get your holy water in the gallon jugs.