Any fans of the Second World Sourcebook?

[DMH]

Derek asked if I'd be releasing any new material for the Second World. I'd still like to do the Tone Warden and Pattern Warden, but there's so much nice and innovative new magic material available from various places that I think there's not a lot I could add.

What sources would you suggest for those two wardens? Not that I have an extensive library on d20 magic, but I can't recall either a sound based spellcaster or one based on patterns/designs.

And thank you for the answer. I hope, someday, there will be a 200 page gazatter (sp?) of the Second World for sale as a pdf and book. Something that includes Earth, Mars and the Forge. All of them are so tantalizing, yet need more to solitify as a setting.

Also, I think d20 Modern offers a unique chance to set players in a world they're familiar with, yet one that can include surprising revelations as the characters discover hidden places or secret organizations.

Spiffy. Can't wait to see that.

 

[Menexenus]

Me three. 2WS is worth getting.

I haven't used the setting, but I've found the crunch analysis to be very informative and well-written.

 

[Dirigible]

right now what I'm planning to do is put together a d20 modern campaign length adventure based around a new Scanners-esque psionics system.

"Make a Perform (Facial Contortions) check."
"Uh oh, natural one..."
"Oooh. Fort save vs HEAD 'ASPLODE!"

I'd like to add that Small Worlds and Exiles is, bar none, the best free adventure I've ever downloaded. Actually, the best adventure I've ever read full stop. I utterly love the way Steve understand like no other designer I know of that the rules are there to facilitate the creation of awesomeness - I don't know of any other writer creating critters with deeply flavourful and cool abilities like World Like Glass, World Like Shattered Glass and Ringing Teeth.

 

[2WS-Steve]

What sources would you suggest for those two wardens? Not that I have an extensive library on d20 magic, but I can't recall either a sound based spellcaster or one based on patterns/designs.

That's true, but my concern is/was that what I'd put together would look an awful lot like house-ruled versions of existing magic systems -- since there are things that are fairly close to what I'd like to do.

For instance, I think that Green Ronin's True Sorcery could work for Tone Wardens. My picture of the Tone Warden was that they'd master a variety of specific frequencies (or tones, or precise musical notes) and each one of those would give the Tone Warden control over certain aspects of the world (e.g. each element, different kinds of animals perhaps) or empowering certain effects(e.g. charming, maybe healing). By simply calling the True Sorcery spells, which are kind of like what I described, tones or notes, the Tone Warden could really just be a prestige class of the True Spellcaster.

Misfit Studio's Spellweaver is actually very close to how I pictured the Pattern Warden -- someone who weaves or constructs patterns of arcane energy.

In the case of True Sorcery I'm a bit concerned that true spellcasters wouldn't be very appealing to a player if they had the normal PHB alternatives, even with some of the suggested adjustments. I haven't yet playtested the Spellweaver enough to see whether they would fit in well in most campaigns.

Finally, what I'd do would probably feel like taking the above, plus the following:

Elements of Magic - Mythic Earth
Elements of Magic - Revised -- Psion has something for this already -- and I should point out that it's pretty different from Mystic Earth, I think enough to count as a distinct system.
Paths of Power
d20 Advanced Magic

-- mushing them all together and then applying a bunch of house rules. I'm not worried about profit so much on this, but I am concerned that what I'd be able to add might not feel like a whole lot.

That said, a toolkit approach that made it easier for GM's to roll their own magic system for their own campaign could be worthwhile. For fantasy worlds, the flavor of the magic the GM chooses has a big impact on the way the world feels. The question is how to do that without it being too much of a pain to work out the details.

 

[DMH]

But how would they be balanced against the other wardens? The ones in the book (plus the gate and rune) have major xp costs to play.

And I am wrong- I forgot ST Cooley's Enchridion of Mystical Music and Green Ronin's eldritch weaver. The latter has the only system for magical learning that ever made sense to me.

 

[Psion]

A quick note about my pattern warden / EoM revised adaptation. I had a player run one in the game. I provided a method for spellcasters to trade in levels to get up to muster in the pattern warden casting level, but modern characters lack this. I thought about adding a talent that would boost their casting level.

 

[2WS-Steve]

But how would they be balanced against the other wardens? The ones in the book (plus the gate and rune) have major xp costs to play.

I'd likely make them pretty much like the rune warden download -- more like a regular spellcaster. It'd be nice to include some bindings as well, since players like not having to rely on magic items, but these would be purchased with the 1 per 3 levels feats, and thus might feel a little expensive. Spellcasting types are really tough, so it's always hard to find ways to give them cool new abilities without overpowering them or nerfing their primary purpose/fun of casting spells.

And I am wrong- I forgot ST Cooley's Enchridion of Mystical Music and Green Ronin's eldritch weaver. The latter has the only system for magical learning that ever made sense to me.

The eldritch weaver and magical learning sounds cool -- which book was that in?

 

[Psion]

The eldritch weaver and magical learning sounds cool -- which book was that in?

Green Ronin's advanced players manual. There's a thread about it here.

 

[2WS-Steve]

A quick note about my pattern warden / EoM revised adaptation. I had a player run one in the game. I provided a method for spellcasters to trade in levels to get up to muster in the pattern warden casting level, but modern characters lack this. I thought about adding a talent that would boost their casting level.

Yeah, that always struck me as a real issue with running someone who had to use the d20 Modern basic classes for the first 3 levels.

A feat or talent like the following should work:

Magical Study:
Intense study of the magical arts increases your spellcasting ability, but at a terrible price to your health.
Benefit: You gain +1 to your caster level for all spellcasting purposes, such as spells/day, spells known, maximum level of spell, and casting effects. This cannot raise your effective casting level above your character level.
This incurs a cost, however. You must make the following sacrifices:

• -1 to base attack bonus
• you sacrifice 4 hit points
• you must spend experience points equal to 1,000 x the number of previous times you have taken this feat

Special: You may take this feat multiple times.


That seems sort of close to the right cost -- a bit profitable though if you take just one level of fighter. But a bit expensive if you take multiple levels of fighter. Also, not sure how it synergizes with the Eldritch Knight. The standard D&D classes with all their front-loading create some thorny patches for this kind of thing.


*****

I was thinking about this a little more after picking up Lost, Season 2. Seems it would make a really cool campaign to take the Lost premise, but drop a bunch of 1st level d20 Modern guys on an island in a D&D world.

I'd restrict them purely to the island, and match up a bit with the Lost series like that -- but the island would have a variety of dungeons on it -- and the players would have to establish a safe zone and maybe help any other survivors set up a little village.

The first dungeon would then have some books on practicing magic, but, since the players wouldn't find them until later, I'd have to deal with the fact they're saddled with those not-terribly-useful Smart Hero levels.

 

[2WS-Steve]

Green Ronin's advanced bestiary. There's a thread about it here.

Thanks -- I'll just go ahead and add that to my shopping cart then.

It's the Advanced Player's Manual though, right?