Armies of The Ancient World

[SHARK]

Greetings!

I don't understand the whole facination--perhaps even obsession--with Japan. I like Japanese mythology and history, but in my opinion, the history and mythology of China is distinctly more interesting. India is very cool, too. I've done some research on China--it is far older than Japan, and what is particularly interesting about China is that from 5000 years ago, the various Chinese dynasties were dealing with a broad array of diplomatic, political, religious, military, economic, and social problems and dynamics that remain relevant to this day. In a similar manner, we study the ancient Greeks and Romans because they too, dealt with similar issues that we face today. The technology was different, but our ancestors were just as interesting and complex as we are today.

What this means in gaming terms is that the Chinese history alone encompasses so much variety and possibilities as campaign inspiration, that it is a shame that that resource is so broadly overlooked. India likewise has something like 3000 years of rich, complex history. Japan, by comparisson, really only has a national/ethnic consciousness of some 800-1500 years. In addition, being on an island, the Japanese were somewhat isolated, and by extension, became insular and myopic. India and China, on the other hand, were constantly in the crossroads of foreign interaction and complex internal and cultural dynamics.

I would also say that south east asia is an overlooked area of interesting culture and history as well.

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

 

[Velik]

SHARK I will agree with everyone what a mentally stimulating post this is and I wish I hadnt left Huntington Beach to move here to Connecticut, I would give my left toe to play in your campaign world hehe.

Anyway you had talked about what if the Roman legions had made it past Persia to possibly face the the Ch'in, wonderful food for thought, but I think the Roman Empire might have thinned itself out too much by then. The Ch'in would be able to deploy their forces with realitve ease being on their "home turf" and the Romans I think would have a harder time replenishing lost forces in a timely manner being such a huge distance away and the Ch'in having roughly the same amount of forces at their finger tips. well just a quick thought that popped into my head and I probably havent thought it all the way through so pick it apart if you like

Heath

 

[Ulrick]

Greetings!

Alaric, thankyou!

I can't really say yet, but you may soon see some official work from me that you can purchase in your wonderful local gamestore! So, I wish to thankyou for your encouragement, as well as to say hang in there, for you might just get what you have asked for!

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

SWEET.

....the various Chinese dynasties were dealing with a broad array of diplomatic, political, religious, military, economic, and social problems and dynamics that remain relevant to this day. In a similar manner, we study the ancient Greeks and Romans because they too, dealt with similar issues that we face today. The technology was different, but our ancestors were just as interesting and complex as we are today....

[/B]

And some of those similarities I shudder at when compared to the things that are going on here in the United States.

In my campaign setting I have an empire that Balkanized (sp?) because they didn't learn from the mistakes of past Empires. It has a very much "decline of Rome" sort of feeling.

When looking at history, I'm always fascinated at how Empires--seemingly unbeatable, collapse. And soon "barbarians are at the gate."

Back to topic:

When designing the countries and realms of my campaign world, I often look at armies of ancient and medieval times and see what I can use. For instance, I admire the way the Roman Legions fought using shield walls and the gladius'. Yet I also admire the Swiss Pikemen. So I combined the two. This balkanized empire that I mentioned used med. infantry as its main fighting unit. They roamed the battlefield in tight phalanxes with tower shields. The tower shields had a hole or two in its center or side for long spears or pikes to slid though--obviously the hole would be carve to fit the spearhead. And it could be used an arrow slit as well.

I'm just picturing a large group of soldiers hunched up inside a "dome" of tower shields, with spears poking out this way and that, while barbarian infantry and cavalry circle trying to figure out what to do.

Of course, if the barbarians had a spell caster with fireball it'd be over right quick...
And yes, there are other flaws with this approach, and I would consider the "dome formation" a last ditch effort...similar to what the Spartans did in the movie "The 300 Spartans." But I think they'd take a lot of enemies down with them.

Ulrick

 

[Leopold]

Greetings!

Alaric, thankyou!

I can't really say yet, but you may soon see some official work from me that you can purchase in your wonderful local gamestore! So, I wish to thankyou for your encouragement, as well as to say hang in there, for you might just get what you have asked for!

Semper Fidelis,

SHARK

SHARK books!! OH I CANT WAIT!

 

[Rashak Mani]

Shark I think Japan gets more attention because China was humiliated time and again this century and the last... Japan on the other hand was twice able to rise from the ashes and humiliation of foreign dominance.

Japan as a society in modern times was more interesting for westerners than the opium induced subservience of China. So the image of the samurai and the ninja are much stronger especially since so many american GIs lived there as occupation forces.

Japans modernization after Admiral Perry was no mean feat... a society mobilized to changing their destiny.

 

[Reprisal]

The Rise and Fall of Great Powers

When looking at history, I'm always fascinated at how Empires--seemingly unbeatable, collapse. And soon "barbarians are at the gate."

There's a book by Paul Kennedy called _The Rise and Fall of Great Powers_. It definately makes sense of the fall of many great powers, although I do not believe it addresses things before 1400 CE... Good book though.

 

[hong]

Shark I think Japan gets more attention because China was humiliated time and again this century and the last... Japan on the other hand was twice able to rise from the ashes and humiliation of foreign dominance.

Japan gets all the attention in the 3E Oriental Adventures book because it also got all the attention in 1E Oriental Adventures. It's a legacy issue; and that, in turn, is directly due to the ninja craze that dominated the pop-culture scene in the early 80s. If the 1E OA had appeared ten years earlier, it would have been in the middle of the kung fu craze, and would have contained tons of material about chop-socky martial arts, funky wuxia moves and other such stuff.

 

[Black Omega]

Probably largely true. Japan is still the nation that holds more facination, despite the HK invasion in movies. India is left a distant third. I have doubts there is enough interest to justify any type of book on doing an India game. Fir China and Japan there is still the books for GURPS and Sengoku from GoldRush Games is an excellent book for Japan as well.