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Message: <blockquote data-quote="MoonSong" data-source="post: 5946772" data-attributes="member: 6689464">Yes, PF archetypes have cut down class proliferation. However it is very different from the proppossed "let's gett rid of as many classes as posible with themes", first, because taking an rachetype doesn't eat away your chances of customization, you are as free to pick your skills and feats regardless of whether you take an archetype or not, in that sense it is almost as good as having an actual new class, it doesn't leads to sameness on characters.Having "themes as classes" just discriminates the players of the demoted classes, you no longer have any chances of customization if you play one of those. And you cannot play any of those if themes are turned off. Now some people have argued that you don''t need rules to make your character unique, that roleplay alone is enough, but no matter how much you roleplay your character, if all paladins must have the same exact background to be paladins then you are missing crucial skill bonuses you would have otherwise and that would fit your character. No matter how much you roleplay your run of the mill paladin as a healer or as a negotiator, or even a musician, you'll never be able to make it count if it doesn't reflects on the dice when you need it. Which may not be bad if it was the same for all, but when your suppossed musician paladin fails and the wizard with the musician background does it and it happens every single time, then your character is a second rate character because he was denied a critical background by virtue of wanting to play a class that has been core in almost every single edition but made the sin of not being one of the "Big four" and was denied being a class in Next.</blockquote>

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