D&D 3E/3.5 Asking for Tips for newbie 3.5 Wizard

Magic missile can destroy mirror images? That is news to me.

In our game, magic missile ignores mirror images. It neither requires an attack roll, nor can it damage non-living things.

If magic missile can destroy mirror images without doing damage to the images, then can I use a Silent image to make for instance 8 arrows to 'strike' however many images a wizard has....same exact effect. No attack roll, no damage done, but the images all get 'attacked'.
 

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Nifft said:
First off, area damage is something only a Wizard can do well. If you need to clear a room of kobolds, fireball is your best option. Direct damage -- especially area damage -- is very useful from level 5 through 12. Below that you're about as useful using a crossbow or Reserve feat, above that you're better off just ending the fight with a big nasty control spell (either a save-or-die, or a denial spell like solid fog).

Secondly, slow is excellent against multi-attackers, but irrelevant against a bunch of low-level foes in close quarters (e.g.: a room full of kobolds).

Third, some Wizards will never need dispel magic. Its utility totally depends on the DM throwing buffed antagonists against you, or enemy spellcasters. At 5th level I'd scribe a scroll of dispel magic, and then don't prepare the spell until you have used the scroll.

Fourth, magic missile can automatically hurt things which are otherwise quite difficult to hurt, like insubstantial monsters in shadowy illumination (e.g. Shadows). Some of these insubstantial things drain ability scores or impose negative levels, so a long fight may indeed kill someone, even if you've got two healers. It counters and dispels mirror image, it ignores displacement, and it shoots through schools of energy resistances. It's honestly kind of broken, since it's the only 1st level attack spell which improves after 5th level... at 5th level it's pretty balanced against lesser acid orb, but by 9th level it outclasses the alternatives.

Hmm... partly agree and partly don't.

1. How often will a roomful of Kobolds be a threat to your party at all once you hit 5th level? Now leveled Kobolds would be something else, but then your Fireball will only do so much. Also, highly circumstantial. I'll find a way to make Grease or Glitterdust useful in every fight. Fireball? Only in special circumstances. I'll give you useful at levels 5-7, but at level 12 (!), I'd rather be doing something else. I can sling 6th level spells by that level, how is 10d6 with a save for half (which most enemies will make at that level) going to compare? Not to speak of fire resistance, which starts to become kinda common once you hit mid levels.

That said, I do advocate direct damage spells from time to time. Their effects stack with what the rest of your party is doing, so that's synergy right there. However, you're the guy the party looks to when less generic answers are needed, so you should concentrate your efforts more on those things. Area damage can easily be done by a big burly guy with a reach weapon and Combat Reflexes, by the way.

2. Slow is all around useful even against many attackers - because it slows quite a few of them down. Even if they don't have more than one attack, it's very useful, as it basically turns them into Zomcies: no move+attack, only move. Oh hey, I moved too! Now they have to spend their action moving again and can't touch me! And all the while their base movement is cut in half, so even a Gnome can run circles around them!

3. Dispel Magic is not only useful against magicked-up enemies, it's also important utility in dungeon surroundings or even in political intrigue campaigns or urban murder mysteries. Sure, it's DM-dependent, but show me a DM who never incorporates magical challenges after level 5! I'd rather not rely on a scroll for things that are caster level dependent. Nor do I like to lock my wealth in a scroll that needs max caster level.

4. Magic Missile is one of the best direct damage spells out there, nobody will deny that. I still thing direct damage is usually better done by other people. Sure, if that Shadow pops out of the wall at low levels, Magic Missile comes in handy. But how many of those do you need to kill the pesky thing? A Shadow has 19 HP on average, at CR 3. Your 3rd level Magic Missiles will deal an average of 7 points of damage. You probably won't have three Magic Missile spells memorised (unless you're a Sorcerer, but that's a different story), so a Magic Weapon spell would have been a better investment.
 
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That's a different spell than the one we were talking about, so I'm not really sure what your issue is regarding mirror image -- but even if we're talking about the other spell, you can use magic missile to clear away greater mirror images and give your allies a clear shot at the enemy.

Cheers, -- N
Only that dispel is different than destroying a spell. Dispelling a someone else spell usually requires a Dispel Magic (any type) to be cast and a successful caster level check being made. While destroying some a spell is just dealing damage to one that allows you to attack it.

Magic missile can destroy mirror images? That is news to me.

In our game, magic missile ignores mirror images. It neither requires an attack roll, nor can it damage non-living things.

If magic missile can destroy mirror images without doing damage to the images, then can I use a Silent image to make for instance 8 arrows to 'strike' however many images a wizard has....same exact effect. No attack roll, no damage done, but the images all get 'attacked'.
Mirror images have AC equal to 10 plus the casters Dex mod. So, when attacking someone with Mirror Image, you determine if you attack an Image or the caster. Next you make you attack roll and see if you it. Finely you apply damage, any image that takes 1 or more points of damage winks out. Magic Missile only let you skip the attack roll.

And arrow made from a Silent Image does no damage to an illusion, belief is required for any illusion to deal damage. (Not including the shadow illusion spells.)
 
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1. How often will a roomful of Kobolds be a threat to your party at all once you hit 5th level?
One word: flankers. A room full of 4 hp kobolds + a kobold or two with Rogue levels = pain. You can't trivially kill the leveled kobolds, but you can remove their tactical advantage, and that's exactly what a Wizard does best.

I'll give you useful at levels 5-7, but at level 12 (!), I'd rather be doing something else. I can sling 6th level spells by that level, how is 10d6 with a save for half (which most enemies will make at that level) going to compare? Not to speak of fire resistance, which starts to become kinda common once you hit mid levels.
At level 10, it should be 15d6 (with Empower Spell). Sure, some things will save, and you shouldn't use even MOST your slots for direct damage, but it can be VERY useful to be able to lay down 30-50 damage in a big area. For example, if you're fighting invisible pixies, or if you manage to surprise a group of enemies who are 400 + 40/level ft. away from you.

That said, I do advocate direct damage spells from time to time. Their effects stack with what the rest of your party is doing, so that's synergy right there. However, you're the guy the party looks to when less generic answers are needed, so you should concentrate your efforts more on those things. Area damage can easily be done by a big burly guy with a reach weapon and Combat Reflexes, by the way.
Not from 400 + 40/level ft. away. Your "reach" weapon isn't much of a threat then.

Or when you're fighting something that likes to Grab, or Swallow, or an Ooze, or a demon coated in weapon-eating slime, or a demon that shreds armor, or a demon that explodes when it dies ... and that's just the demons who start with the letter "B".

Area damage is also good against swarms. Reach weapons fail just as hard as any other weapon.

2. Slow is all around useful even against many attackers - because it slows quite a few of them down. Even if they don't have more than one attack, it's very useful, as it basically turns them into Zomcies: no move+attack, only move. Oh hey, I moved too! Now they have to spend their action moving again and can't touch me! And all the while their base movement is cut in half, so even a Gnome can run circles around them!
Slow is also a good spell. But it won't clear a hallway full of green slime, nor will it save you from a relentless squad of mummies hell-bent on vengeance.

3. Dispel Magic is not only useful against magicked-up enemies, it's also important utility in dungeon surroundings or even in political intrigue campaigns or urban murder mysteries. Sure, it's DM-dependent, but show me a DM who never incorporates magical challenges after level 5! I'd rather not rely on a scroll for things that are caster level dependent. Nor do I like to lock my wealth in a scroll that needs max caster level.
Well, if he uses that scroll as soon as you seem to think, it will be at his max caster level -- no loss. If he needs it as seldom as I think, his caster level won't matter -- minimal loss.

4. Magic Missile is one of the best direct damage spells out there, nobody will deny that. I still thing direct damage is usually better done by other people. Sure, if that Shadow pops out of the wall at low levels, Magic Missile comes in handy. But how many of those do you need to kill the pesky thing? A Shadow has 19 HP on average, at CR 3. Your 3rd level Magic Missiles will deal an average of 7 points of damage. You probably won't have three Magic Missile spells memorised (unless you're a Sorcerer, but that's a different story), so a Magic Weapon spell would have been a better investment.
Meh, magic weapon is a spell you can get the Cleric to cast.

A wand of magic missile (level 3-5) is cheap, considering how long it remains useful.

Cheers, -- N
 

Thanks for the tips and such. Wands are something I was thinking if my char should someday buy since with the spell point system casting a 2nd level spell is more costly then a 1st level and so on. Buy and save xp or make and save money, is the main choice I guess, as well as for other item creation feats, but that won't come in till later levels. not sure when chars get their first feat after level 1.

I guess scrolls are mainly useful for spells useful outside combat?

I guess it can be hard trying to guess which spells will be the most useful to prepare in advance.
 
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Thanks, never thought of that. I guess wands, with their 50 charges, are cheaper then having scrolls over the long course. Also I guess wand may be more important in the spell point system since it would conserve spell points, especially with the spells taking up more points the higher level they are.
 

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