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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Mistwell" data-source="post: 4121862" data-attributes="member: 2525">Show me the indirectness then.  People keep fiating over the only critical part of this discussion.  If you think Fast Healing is independent of the spell itself, then show me in the rules where it suggests an independence.  I understand that you yourself think of it as independent, but you need to explain WHY.  Just asserting "it is" and then offering more analogies isn't compelling.  Take me through the language in the rules that suggests that Fast Healing is independent of the thing that "grants" Fast Healing.I'm not.  I am asking for where in the mechanics it reads the way you suggest, and I keep getting analogies and opinions and gut instincts and no rules quotes that suggest it works the way you says it does.  On our side, we have a rules quote that says that any conjuration [healing] spell can gain the benefit of the feat.  We have the official FAQ agreeing.  We have the text of the conjuration [healing] general description.  And we have the spell itself saying it heals.  EVERY rules quote suggests to me that mechanically speaking Augment Healing (the feat) works with Vigor spells.  And on your side we have, in addition to those analogies and instincts and feelings,  the typical Hypersmurf "yeah but then this completely other thing might not work perfectly consistently within the rules" which he's proven time and again can be applied to any rule at any time regardless of whether or not the side he is taking in the debate is actually correct (we know already the rules are not perfect and can result in inconsistent results and we just need to deal with that as a general issue).Oh here we go again - let's not quote the rules involved with this issue, lets find a strawman to distract from those rules...Yeah, it's the same summoning example used four times already in this thread.  It's a great example of the different between this spell (which is direct) and a summoning spell (which is not).When did I make that assertion?  What argument of mine do you think you are responding to (I suspect it is someone elses)?Any really, outrageous? Exaggerate much? I did say there IS a different between direct and indirect, and also said in this case it's direct.  That in fact is my entire contention.  This spell directly heals you.  Unlike a summoning spell, this spell is itself healing you of damage, and is a conjuration [healing] spell, and hence can gain the benefit of Augmented Healing.  Fast Healing is a short-hand rules description for how a type of healing spell or ability heals over time rather than all at once, but it is not itself it's own entity that intervenes as an indirect healing thing like a summoning spell does.  In this case, it's a spell directly healing.</blockquote>

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