Auras and condition denial

[sfedi]

Perhaps you meant "stunned" instead of "dazed".

(you CAN take free actions while Dazed)

 

[Dr_Ruminahui]

Ocrejelly, I'm sure there are other auras you would have issues with - for example, rat and needledrake swarms' auras gives them a free basic attack against adjascent targets.

So there are other creatures out there whose auras seem more like active effects rather than passive ones - and it may seem strange to have those persist when the creature is unable to act.

And I disagree with Camelot - I don't think its about the game, as I don't see folks worrying about swarms auras continuing because it is unballanced, but rather because it doesn't seem to make sense. Well, unless you mean "about the game" to mean "for story reasons", in which case I do agree with you.

 

[Mouseferatu]

Well, I'd argue, modelling the beholder's ability as an aura was a mistake in this case. If it isn't an automatic effect, then why is it an aura?

Indeed. In Monster Manual 2, the new beholder variants don't have auras. They have a free attack that largely duplicates the effects of the aura on the MM1 beholders.

 

[Camelot]

Well, unless you mean "about the game" to mean "for story reasons", in which case I do agree with you.

That is precisely what I mean. Having it active all the time could be unbalanced for one group's game because they are a ragtag team without much cooperation skills, or the DM and players would prefer a game with suspense and drama (among other possibilities), but it could be good for another group because the group is comprised of experienced gamers who can handle such a situation, or the DM and players like a game with a lot of action and thrill (again, among other reasons).

You can't have the rules be uniformly balance for every game without the rules being very boring and based completely on luck, because you can never account for the skill level of the players. That is, the rules writers can't. That's why many people don't like multiplayer video games, because they're friends always beat them. RPGs are unique in that the DM can tweak the rules so that it fits the players and they have fun, because what is fun for some is not so for others. There is no one right rule about auras or one wrong one; it depends on the DM and the players, i.e. on the group, i.e. on the game, as in the game specific to that group.

Heh...hope that clarifies what I meant!

Do what's fun for your group.

 

[Jhaelen]

Indeed. In Monster Manual 2, the new beholder variants don't have auras. They have a free attack that largely duplicates the effects of the aura on the MM1 beholders.

Ah, excellent! Looks like my reasoning wasn't too far off

 

[Starfox]

Indeed. In Monster Manual 2, the new beholder variants don't have auras. They have a free attack that largely duplicates the effects of the aura on the MM1 beholders.

Yay! Another triumph for exception-based design... Not!

 

[eamon]

From a gameplay perspective, I can imagine that it's not nice to have active aura's on dying creatures. Many monsters have a lot of hitpoints, and even a coup-de-grace or two won't necessarily take them out. It may turn into a jarring stomp-on-the-dead scene, which I'd like to avoid.

From a consistency standpoint; well, when does and aura stop? Why would an intense fire aura suddenly stop at 0 hitpoints - but why instantly stop when the creature is dead? That kind of thing is just really flavor specific. But regeneration also stops when creatures hit 0 hitpoints: Basically, to me, it suggests that at 0 hitpoints, creatures are as good as dead - they've a chance to recover still - but they're out of it at the moment. Aura's can be suppressed and restarted as a minor action, in general - which suggests that there's is some level of conscious control (in some vague general sense).

So, for gameplay reasons primarily, and to reflect the fact that there is normally some amount of conscious focus involved, and to mirror the fact that pretty much everything else you do stops at 0 hit points, I'd say aura's cease when a creature drops, except in specific situations where believability or drama demand otherwise.

 

[Starfox]

From a consistency standpoint; well, when does and aura stop? Why would an intense fire aura suddenly stop at 0 hitpoints - but why instantly stop when the creature is dead?

Monsters and characters controlled by the Dungeon Master usually die when they reach 0 hit points, unless you choose to knock them out (see “Knocking Creatures Unconscious”). You generally don’t need to stalk around the battlefield after a fight, making sure all your foes are dead.

The distinction between dead an unconscious monsters is moot. Negative Hp are only for player characters. Its simply not worth bothering with for NPCs and monsters.