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[Axiomatic Unicorn]

CRGreathouse,

Very minor error in the dragon generator, the copper dragon's slow weapon has a fortitude save (not will). (Unless I missed some errata somewhere)

 

[drowdude]

What about class levels for the Iconics? Is that A-OK or should we avoid stuff like that?


(Sorry for all the questions... I am just trying to ensure that I dont come up with something completely off the wall compared to the rest of you )

 

[Axiomatic Unicorn]

I am all for adding class levels to dragons, but not the iconics.
If you add a level of wizard to Redgar, he would not be the iconic fighter anymore.

IMHO

 

[CRGreathouse]

I am all for adding class levels to dragons, but not the iconics.
If you add a level of wizard to Redgar, he would not be the iconic fighter anymore.

IMHO

Strike the "IMHO" ans replace with "IMNSHO" and you have my exact viewpoint.

**********************

Here's the format I'm using for the Iconic black:

All black dragons have the following special abilities:
SQ–Immunities (Ex): Immune to sleep, acid, and paralysis.
SQ–Water Breathing (Ex): This dragon can breathe underwater indefinitely and can freely use its breath weapons, spells, and other abilities while submerged.
SQ–Blindsight (Ex): Dragons can ascertain creatures by nonvisual means (mostly hearing and scent, but also by noticing vibrations and other environmental clues) with a range of 30 feet per age category.
SQ–Keen Senses (Ex): Dragons can see four times as well as humans in low-light conditions and twice as well in normal light. They have darkvision with a range of 100 feet per age category.

When Lepros was born, he was expected... [continue for 2-3 paragraphs]

Lepros, wyrmling black dragon: CR 2; Tiny Dragon (Water); HD 4d12+4; hp 30; Init +0; Spd 60 ft, fly 100 ft (average), swim 60 ft; AC 15 (+2 size, +3 natural); Melee bite +6 (1d4), 2 claws +1 (1d3); SA breath weapon; SQ water breathing, blindsight, immunities, keen senses; Face/Reach 2½ ft by 2½ ft / 5 ft; AL CE; SV Fort +5, Ref +4, Will +4; Str 11, Dex 10, Con 13, Int 8, Wis 11, Cha 8.
Skills and Feats: Bluff +3, Escape Artist +4, Listen +4, Search +3, Spot +4; Hover, Flyby Attack.
SA–Breath Weapon (Su): Line of acid, 30 feet long, every 1d4 rounds; damage 2d4, Reflex half DC 13.

As Lepros aged, ...

 

[Gargoyle]

I agree, no class levels for the iconic dragons, and since Charles is the king of the stat block we should use his format.

I think equipment and treasure should be included, as well as a description of the dragon's lair, including any defenses, and any allies or minions.

All this for each age category...I'll try to have something significant for the blue finished by the end of the weekend. Fun stuff!

 

[CRGreathouse]

I'm still working on the Iconic black, but it'll take me some time to finish it - I'm quite busy these days.

If anyone would like to see waht I have so far (for the purpose of making your own Iconic), drop me a line and I'll send it as an attachment - MS Word 2000 unless you'd prefer a different format.

My email address is everywhere - click "email CRGreathouse", or go to the BADD members page, or go to the SSBF's member page, or go to my generator site main page...

As for equipment/treasure, this is a must. I think I'll use a ratio of 9:1 of standard treasure to equipment the dragon will use. If the dragon should have 10,000 gp of treasure, I think I'll give it 1,000 gp of useful stuff and 9,000 of gems and things it can't/won't use (gems, coins, magic swords, etc.).

Any thoughts on treasure? Is there a better way? Remember, *if* players do defeat a dragon, they deserve a good haul; most monsters use much less than 10% of their treasure, anyway.

 

[maddman75]

Agreed - keep it simple. Remember that the iconics are supposed to be typical. Make them a typical dragon of their kind, one that could be used in examples in other articles. That's the real goal - so if someone refers to Lepros in an article about dragons using terrain to their advantage, everyone knows that you are referring to the Black dragon that has a lair in the middle of a vast swamp.

Leave the class levels, templates, and unusual settings/allies for the descriptions of individual dragons.

 

[Axiomatic Unicorn]

As for equipment/treasure, this is a must. I think I'll use a ratio of 9:1 of standard treasure to equipment the dragon will use. If the dragon should have 10,000 gp of treasure, I think I'll give it 1,000 gp of useful stuff and 9,000 of gems and things it can't/won't use (gems, coins, magic swords, etc.).

Any thoughts on treasure? Is there a better way? Remember, *if* players do defeat a dragon, they deserve a good haul; most monsters use much less than 10% of their treasure, anyway.

That sounds good. My only concern is that I think double standard is not really enough to make a reasonable horde. This, to me, is a case of WoTC putting expected character wealth above the established vision of a dragon. Not to mention that the biased low CRs further reduce the horde value.

Should we stick by the book for the iconics, or should we stand up and proclaim that ALL dragons should have their just horde, who cares about WoTC's so-called balance!!!!!!

 

[CRGreathouse]

Should we stick by the book for the iconics

Yes, stick to the book for iconics. We'll have plenty of time to break the standards with our custi\om dragons - can you say "young adult half-elemental (water)/half black dragon Bbn4"?

 

[maddman75]

Cupchal the Copper dragon is on the iconics page. Thought I'd get him up ASAP so everyone could get a look at the format.