Balance this spell: Improved Magic Missle

[Mort]

I would have to agree.
The Orb line of spells aren't even close to that powerful, and I already think they're a bit too much.

I'd have to disagree, the orb spells seem quite a bit better. Yes they require a touch attack but:

1) they do more damage to a single target (15d6 max I believe) plus have additional effects i believe (don't have the books with me)

2) Orb spells are not subject to spell resistance - this compeletely negates the fact that they need a touch attack as a high level caster is much more worried about SR than touch AC

 

[Cake Mage]

Having two different level-dependent damage variables is just goofy.

As a level 4 spell, you should be looking at a Maximized Magic Missile for comparison. As such, 2d6+n/missile is just a little too good.

2d6 per missile (or, if you prefer, 2d4+2) with a max of 5 missiles would be just about right.

2d4+2 per lvl? so Maximun lvl: 5x(2d4+2) = 50pts? or is that 5x(2d4)+20? (+2 per lvl) =60

what if we change the bonus dmg to +1/ ever 2 lvls but max +5?
At max lvl(10th): 5x (2d6+5) = 85 .hhmmmm

 

[Mustrum_Ridcully]

I wouldn't go into the direction of more damage, but in the direction of longer duration.

Eldritch Barrage:
Level: Sorceror/Wizard 4
School: Evocation [Force]
Components: V, M
Casting Time: Standard
Range: Medium (100 ft + 10 ft per level)
Effect: Several magic missiles
Duration: 1 round per 2 levels
Saving Throw: No
Spell Resistance: Yes
Description:
This spell allows the caster to create a similar effect as a Magic Missile spell each round.

Each round (including the round he is casting the spell), the caster can fire one Magic Missile per every 2 caster Levels (up to a maximum of 10 missiles at level 20), each dealing 1d4+1 points of force damage to its target.
The spell can be blocked by the same effects a Magic Missile spell can be blocked, except that it is treated as a spell of its own level (normally 4), not that of Magic Missile (normally 1). (A Minor Glove of Invulnerabiity would block a Magic Missile spell, but not Eldritch Barrage. The shield spell would block both spells).

Balance wise, this spell is similar to Rary's Mnemonic Enhancer, which would allow you to use one 4th level slot to fill it with 3 1st level Magic Missile Spells. Eldritch Barrage is a bit better than that, but it's also not as flexible as Rary's Mnemonic Enhancer. If you still think it's to good, you could increase the spell level by one or reduce the amount of missiles gained (maybe to 1 missile per 3 caster levels, topping out at 5 missiles at level 15)

 

[Goolpsy]

Yes or make it 4 @ lvl 7, 5 at 9, etc. until 10 at lvl 19...

Each dealing 1d6 + 1 (4,5 Average)... so at lvl 19 you have an average of 45.. Varying from 20 to 70 damage...

15 Orbs deal an average of 3,5 * 15 = 52,5 varying from 15 to 90..

hmm Still seems like way too high damage compared to orbs..


How about make it lvl 5, and same rules and maybe up the damage to d8 ?
Still overkill?

 

[maggot]

At 7th level, this creates 5 missiles that do 2d6+2 each. That's 14d6+14 to one target without a save. That's way too much by a factor of 2.

Wow! I have no idea what I was thinking when I posted that.

At 7th level, you get 4 missiles that do 2d6+2 each for 8d6+2.
At 9th level, you get 5 missiles that do 2d6+3 each for 10d6+15.

This is force damage with no save, no touch attack required, no energy resistance applicable.

Compare to empowered scorching ray (a 4th level spell) at caster level 9: two touch attacks for 4d6*(1.5) fire which would do about 42 if you hit twice and the defender had no fire resistance. This spell does 50, and you always hit and don't have to worry about fire resistance. And you don't need the empower spell feat.

(Also, a 4th level spell mentions caster levels below 7th, and maxes out dice at 9th level is rather strange.)

 

[Dargon]

1) they do more damage to a single target (15d6 max I believe) plus have additional effects i believe (don't have the books with me)

yes their is a save for additional effect

2) Orb spells are not subject to spell resistance - this compeletely negates the fact that they need a touch attack as a high level caster is much more worried about SR than touch AC

You a kidding right? I find that it works the other way around (at least for wizard and sorc builds with full caster levels.)

Most of the time I find SR a joke (but not the D. Elves's SR). At least the Ranged touch Ac increase if the enemy is engaged in combat.

 

[IanB]

Hm, you should probably start the progression from the first level that the spell becomes available, for a start - thus:

Level 7 - 1 missile
Level 9 - 2 missiles
Level 11 - 3 missiles
Level 13 - 4 missiles
Level 15 and up - 5 missiles

Otherwise the per-level thing is pretty pointless since you start already casting 4 missiles.

In any case, I would use metamagic-ed versions of magic missile as my baseline comparison for figuring out what level this should be. At level 4, it looks to be better than a maximized magic missile by a fair amount, so it should definitely be higher level, or weakened.

 

[Plane Sailing]

As a level 4 spell, you should be looking at a Maximized Magic Missile for comparison.

I think this is a key point. It shouldn't be as good as maximised magic missile (which costs a feat) and that would only do 5 damage per missile, so we are talking about 20 or 25 force damage.

 

[IanB]

I think this is a key point. It shouldn't be as good as maximised magic missile (which costs a feat) and that would only do 5 damage per missile, so we are talking about 20 or 25 force damage.

Well, I'm not sure that follows. After all, maximized magic missile does less average damage than empowered magic missile, which is a level lower.

 

[RainOfSteel]

I think this is a key point. It shouldn't be as good as maximised magic missile (which costs a feat) and that would only do 5 damage per missile, so we are talking about 20 or 25 force damage.

Well, I'm not sure that follows. After all, maximized magic missile does less average damage than empowered magic missile, which is a level lower.

I definitely do not believe that it follows. It would be far better to look at existing spells and compare damage amounts than to drag in feat-boosted versions of earlier similar spells.

Yeah, I wasn't sure how to reword it, and I'm pretty sure he just copied ot over from magic missle.

The spell as given is not in acceptable condition to be reviewed by a DM. It contains rules that are incorrect, specifically instructions for how many missiles are achieved at caster levels lower than the caster level of the spell.

My recommendation is that you ask for a re-write. This shouldn't be your headache.

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I would allow the following (for ordinary spell research):

Level: Sor/Wiz 4
Type: Evocation [force]
Components: V, S
Range: Medium (100 ft. + 10 ft./level)
Target: Up to 5 creatures, no two of which can be more than 15 ft. apart
Duration: Instantaneous.
Saving Throw: None
Spell Resistance: Yes

This spell produces magic spears of force resembling great swords that fly through the air to unerringly strike their designated targets. Each does 2d4+4 points of damage. Each possesses all the advantages and disadvantages of standard Magic Missile missiles. One Missile is produced per 4 caster levels (caster level divide by 2, round down) up to a maximum of five missiles at 20th level.

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Wizards of 7th level start with 1 missile.
Sorcerers of 8th level start with 2 missiles.

Damage Curve:

            Max   Min   Avg  Sor/Wiz Level
1 Missile:  12    6     9    7/-
2 Missiles: 24    12    18   8/8
3 Missiles: 36    18    27   12/12
4 Missiles: 48    24    36   16/16
5 Missiles: 60    30    45   20/20

I believe this is less devastating in the scheme of things in comparison to other spells, but is made up for by its automatic hit and its [Force] descriptor. (The keywords being "I believe".)

EDIT----------------

When I think about it for a few minutes, at lower caster levels, that's worse than Magic Missile. A 7th level caster has 4 Magic Missile missiles (1,3,5,7), for 4d4+4, or 20/8/14.

Hmm, perhaps I'd revise the damage up a bit. I'll have to think about it more.