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Banishing Eldritch Blast
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<blockquote data-quote="clearstream" data-source="post: 7518082" data-attributes="member: 71699"><p>Interesting points. Hex and Hellish both are both conditioned on events: for the sake of argument lets call those satisfied. I think combats run about five turns, so...</p><p></p><p><u>Tier 1</u> <em>4th Warlock vs CR 2 creature</em></p><p><strong>Rebuke</strong> caps at 6d10 * chance of failed DEX save = say +3 vs Warlock's DC 14 = 50% = 17ish + Toll x5 = 32.5*.5 = +16ish = 33ish</p><p><strong>Hex</strong> caps at 4d6 * chance of hitting = say AC 13 vs Warlock's +6 Attack = 70% = 10ish + Agonizing on 4x beams = 22+16*.7 = +27ish = 37ish</p><p></p><p>Higher tiers will go even more heavily to Agonizing, which also has better range. As you say, Rebuke/Eldritch Blast is better than Hex/Eldritch Blast in a damage contest. Rebuke/Toll doesn't appear to be. That could change in cases where the Warlock is faced by (and knows they are faced by) foes with markedly poor Dex and Wis saves.</p><p></p><p>A concerning downside is Rebuke has to monopolise casting slots. Hex lasts an hour, so a Warlock can rest and recover slots. That plays out as the Hex Warlock throwing things like clutch Synaptic Statics, or Dimension Door bail outs. Resting and carrying over also means that I've low-balled the Hex damage (removing a turn of Blasts): over a day, it will be greater than shown. Versus either, Greater Invis. (Archfey) cast on a GWM Barbarian or Archery Ranger will be stronger than Rebuke or Hex. I just use Hex just as a sort of yardstick for damage a Warlock spell slot can do. Spamming EB in every turn the Warlock isn't casting a spell.</p><p></p><p>The change I suggest aims to broaden viable strategies by giving whatever bonuses Invocations apply to Blast, to all damage-dealing cantrips that a Warlock has. This would make Rebuke/Toll a valid strategy: shorter range, and more slots invested, but better damage. In my opinion, and to my taste, the effective buff (lots more options in combat) would be correctly balanced by toning Agonizing down slightly in comparison with other attacks. The much reviled "Once per turn" nerf. There are two reasons I like that possible change.</p><p></p><p>1) In play, Warlocks don't hit with every beam, every turn. At tier 1, once per turn makes no difference. At higher tiers, the difference is ameliorated by a tendency to not hit each turn with every beam.</p><p>2) I use a factoring of about 2/3rds ranged damage to melee. This means that if a 120' attack is doing on average 22 damage, then I think of that as equally viable as a melee attack that does 33. Observably, ranged attacks enjoy about 20% more up-time than melee attacks, but I also consider target choice, and character defence (safety/ability to stay in the fight/consumption of resources to stay in the fight). I think the minimum ratio would be that a melee attack must do +20% over a ranged, to be equally viable.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="clearstream, post: 7518082, member: 71699"] Interesting points. Hex and Hellish both are both conditioned on events: for the sake of argument lets call those satisfied. I think combats run about five turns, so... [U]Tier 1[/U] [I]4th Warlock vs CR 2 creature[/I] [B]Rebuke[/B] caps at 6d10 * chance of failed DEX save = say +3 vs Warlock's DC 14 = 50% = 17ish + Toll x5 = 32.5*.5 = +16ish = 33ish [B]Hex[/B] caps at 4d6 * chance of hitting = say AC 13 vs Warlock's +6 Attack = 70% = 10ish + Agonizing on 4x beams = 22+16*.7 = +27ish = 37ish Higher tiers will go even more heavily to Agonizing, which also has better range. As you say, Rebuke/Eldritch Blast is better than Hex/Eldritch Blast in a damage contest. Rebuke/Toll doesn't appear to be. That could change in cases where the Warlock is faced by (and knows they are faced by) foes with markedly poor Dex and Wis saves. A concerning downside is Rebuke has to monopolise casting slots. Hex lasts an hour, so a Warlock can rest and recover slots. That plays out as the Hex Warlock throwing things like clutch Synaptic Statics, or Dimension Door bail outs. Resting and carrying over also means that I've low-balled the Hex damage (removing a turn of Blasts): over a day, it will be greater than shown. Versus either, Greater Invis. (Archfey) cast on a GWM Barbarian or Archery Ranger will be stronger than Rebuke or Hex. I just use Hex just as a sort of yardstick for damage a Warlock spell slot can do. Spamming EB in every turn the Warlock isn't casting a spell. The change I suggest aims to broaden viable strategies by giving whatever bonuses Invocations apply to Blast, to all damage-dealing cantrips that a Warlock has. This would make Rebuke/Toll a valid strategy: shorter range, and more slots invested, but better damage. In my opinion, and to my taste, the effective buff (lots more options in combat) would be correctly balanced by toning Agonizing down slightly in comparison with other attacks. The much reviled "Once per turn" nerf. There are two reasons I like that possible change. 1) In play, Warlocks don't hit with every beam, every turn. At tier 1, once per turn makes no difference. At higher tiers, the difference is ameliorated by a tendency to not hit each turn with every beam. 2) I use a factoring of about 2/3rds ranged damage to melee. This means that if a 120' attack is doing on average 22 damage, then I think of that as equally viable as a melee attack that does 33. Observably, ranged attacks enjoy about 20% more up-time than melee attacks, but I also consider target choice, and character defence (safety/ability to stay in the fight/consumption of resources to stay in the fight). I think the minimum ratio would be that a melee attack must do +20% over a ranged, to be equally viable. [/QUOTE]
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