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Message: <blockquote data-quote="kerbarian" data-source="post: 6375475" data-attributes="member: 40393">For comparing Barbarian and Fighter, here are alternate builds:6th-level Human Berserker Barbarian:Str: 18 (15 + 1 racial + 2 AB), Dex: 14, Con: 16 (15 + 1 racial), Int: 8, Wis: 10, Cha: 8AC: 17 (15 half plate + 2 dex)HP: 65Weapon:  GreatswordFeat:  Great Weapon Mastery6th-level Human Battlemaster FighterStr: 20 (15 + 1 racial + 4 AB), Dex: 14, Con: 16 (15 + 1 racial), Int: 8, Wis: 10, Cha: 8AC: 19 (18 plate + 1 defense fighting style)HP: 58Weapon:  GreatswordFeat:  Great Weapon MasteryFighting style:  Defense (works out better than Great Weapon Fighting)Round 1, no limited-use abilities:As his default attack, the barbarian uses Reckless Attack and the -5 attack and +10 damage from GWM.  Also, as the average damage of his attacks will kill a Minotaur in 4 hits, I'll assume that 25% of hits trigger an extra attack from GWM.DPR: 37.46DTPR: 42.05RIS: 1.55Overall Effectiveness (DPR x RIS): 58.1He hits like a truck but also goes down fast.  Significantly more effective (by this measure) than the original barbarian build, though.[sblock=Barbarian DPR notes]With the -5 to attack from GWM plus Reckless Attack, the barbarian hits on a 12 and has advantage.Chance of crit:  0.975 (1 - 0.95^2)Chance of hit:  0.60 (1 - 0.55^2 - 0.975)Damage on crit:  28 (4d6 + 4 str + 10 GWM)Damage on hit:  21 (2d6 + 4 str + 10 GWM)Average damage per attack:  15.33 (0.0975 * 28 + 0.60 * 21)Chance per hit of triggering an extra attack:  0.2475 (0.975 + 0.60 * 0.25)Chance of an extra attack:  0.4337 (1 - (1 - 0.2475)^2)DPR:  37.46 (15.33 * 2.4337)[/sblock]The fighter also uses the -5 to hit and +10 damage from GWM.  It's still a slight upgrade in this case, even without Reckless Attack.DPR:  26.09DTPR:  22.35RIS:  2.60Overall Effectiveness (DPR x RIS): 67.8[sblock=Fighter DPR notes]With the -5 to attack from GWM, he hits on an 11.  Again, his average damage will kill a Minotaur in 4 hits, so I assume that 25% of hits trigger an extra attack from GWM.Chance of crit:  0.05Chance of hit:  0.45Damage on crit:  29 (4d6 + 5 str + 10 GWM)Damage on hit:  22 (2d6 + 5 str + 10 GWM)Average damage per attack:  11.35 (0.05 * 29 + 0.45 * 22)Chance per hit of triggering an extra attack:  0.1625 (0.05 + 0.45 * 0.25)Chance of an extra attack:  0.2986 (1 - (1 - 0.1625)^2)DPR:  26.09 (11.35 * 2.2986)[/sblock]Round 2, 6-round combat with special abilitiesBarbarian with Rage, Frenzy, Reckless Strike, and GWM:DPR: 47.39 (1 round @ 2 attacks, 5 rounds @ 3 attacks)DTPR: 21.03RIS: 3.09Overall Effectiveness (DPR x RIS): 146.5Barbarian with Rage, Reckless Strike, and GWM:DPR: 39.49DTPR: 21.03RIS: 3.09Overall Effectiveness (DPR x RIS): 122.0Fighter with Action Surge, Riposte x4, Second Wind, and GWM.DPR:  39.48DTPR: 22.35RIS:  3.11 (counts extra HP from Second Wind)Overall Effectiveness (DPR x RIS): 122.8Conclusion:The fighter is still more effective without tricks than the barbarian is, but not by such a large margin, and both builds get significantly higher numbers than the original sword & board versions.I think the most reasonable comparison is the barbarian with rage (but no Frenzy) vs. the fighter with all his tricks, and that's very even.  The barbarian can pull ahead with Frenzy, but that's probably best to use only once per day.</blockquote>

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