Battlefield Adventures - Andy Collins speaks!

Ankh-Morpork Guard said:
Well, I can see what you mean, but have a look at the latest preview for Lost Empires of Faerun. The PrCs, Feats, and Spells are ALL in Chapter 1, with at least 10 Chapters total. Seems that they're turning around the trend with at least one book, which means they can do it again.

More like continuing a trend - The region/orginization books for FR ( and Eberron too, I guess, with Sharn ) have been my favorite WotC books, because they contain enough fluff to suitably frame the offered crunch in context.
 

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Ankh-Morpork Guard said:
Andy gets way more crap than he deserves and its getting to the point where it just plain annoys me.

Bingo!

Of course it is a good filter to help determine which people deserve to be on my ignore list.
 
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DungeonMaster said:
Maximized+ empowered + clinging + yadda yadda breath weapons isn't "going out of your way to abuse the rules". I'm sure the dragon *could* take toughness 4 times instead of these feats but if you were the dragon in a draconomicon compliant world which feats would you choose?
Taking a chain of feats from a single source and applying it isn't "rules abuse". At some point one needs to realise the rules are "poorly designed" when the breath weapon can kill your entire party if they make their saves.
D&D game design isn't rocket science. At some level you expect basic mathematical understanding of what it is is being put into print from the "lead designers", at least I do.

You basically can't use the draconomicon in good faith that you're not going to obliterate the PCs with a "supposed" appropriate CR encounter.

Anyhow, I'm not surprised Andy has his few fans. As long as he stays the hell away from 4th edition there's still hope.

So you take your Dragon with it's juiced up Breath Weapon and throw himinto a battle.

I'll take a group of PC's who know what type of breath weapon your dragon will be using.
The CR of Dragon is afterall based on a group of prepared PCs.

The PC's will juice up their saves, maybe take a PrC with Breath Weapon Evasion, have Contingency Resist Elements running, and the Melee types will have Energy Immunity on.
For fun maybe even throw in a Paladin/Platinum Knight/Vassal of Bahamut. And let's not forget the Caster's are ready to dispell anything the dragon throws out.

Since your dragon spent all of his feats on his breath weapon, what does he do when it isn't effective?

Still not an easy battle for the PCs but if they are up to the CR they have a decent shot.

BTW: I'm a big fan of the Draconomicon, unfortunately the main campaign I play in Dragon's are almost nonexistent (Scarred Lands).
 

If this book is more than a collection of PrC, feats and spells, count me in.
Andy's post got me interested.


Pinotage said:
Sounds a lot like the new series is following in the footsteps of Monte Cooks 'Event' books.
IMHO that's a good thing (seeing the Requiem for a God is one of my favorite d20 books of all time).
 

It's really impossible to judge something this early in the process, but the idea behind the book is a good one and does fill a need, and from what I've seen out there already in this area (I have several of these already), it can be done better.
 

I often wondered who died and made Andy Collins a convenient scapegoat - and one who's words are horribly misquoted at times (dwarves and dexterity penalty house rule). Of course, no one died. Andy is simply a guy who has acted as a "face" for the game, especially during the time the revisions came (and his influence in that team effort is somewhat overrated; at least one revision he said he proposed that I wanted to see was overruled*). I guess it's more satisfying to attach a name to a complaint, even if it is unclear who is actually responsible.

DungeonMaster said:
#4 Andy Collins ran the development - I'm sorry not one book that bears his name on the cover isn't horribly broken in some aspect and mindnumbingly dumb in others.
Using that line of reason is rather odd. Most books have such things that might have slipped through, regardless of an "Andy Collins" on the cover or not.

So it's ok to reprint, I don't know TONS of material from other books like PrC, feats and the complete rehash but in a book on battlefields it's not ok to reprint mass combat rules?
I'm both glad and sad about the "no mass combat." I don't think I need to explain why I'm sad about it in a book about adventures during war time. but I'm glad because
a) I don't want the MiniHB mass combat system (and that would be the one WotC would be using). Because it technically isn't even a mass combat system, it's a bigger miniatures game.
b) No one wants that much rehash. It would not be enough to reprint the mass combat rules themselves - since they are based on the Mini game, you'd have to reprint a significant portion of those rules as well. That's about 80-100 pages of straight reprinting (not even revising, as was done in the Complete series). Battlefield Adventures has 160 pages. Adding that system (with adding the requisite pages) would mean that 1/3 at least is taken up by it. A damn lot for the first book in a new, experimental series.

Maximized+ empowered + clinging + yadda yadda breath weapons isn't "going out of your way to abuse the rules".
Maybe not, but it is "going out of your way to find killer combos," something that does not need "Andy-content" to work.

Andy Collins has made mistakes in his works that can clearly be attributed to him (Steel Predators speak Terran, but are naturally deaf. And yes, saving throws do follow formulas). But so have many other designers. Such as Monte Cook, who seems to have a nice track record of forgetting the Enchantment subschools (or the idea that a spellcaster chooses which spell will be the spell he'll be so good with in the future at first level...).

* Retroactive skill points, for those interested
 

Whisperfoot said:
Bingo!

Of course it is a good filter to help determine which people deserve to be on my ignore list.

Agreed. When people start making comments that are not worth response, it is pretty easy to conclude that their next comment will not be worth reading.
 


Wulf Ratbane said:
[Pimp alert!]

May I recommend the Mass Combat system by the designer of the ENnie-Award winning GRIM TALES?

Short, sweet, clean design, using an EL-based system.

http://www.rpgnow.com/product_info.php?products_id=4037&

Just $1.95, and the download includes a spreadsheet to help the GM prepare.

[/done pimpin']

Wulf

How can I say no :cool:

BUT, does this EL system (and/or the attached spreadsheet) take into account PC capabilities. Can high level PCs take on an army of mooks (or at least sway the battle?)
 

This seems like an interesting idea, which I would consider buying if the reviews indicate it's what I'm looking for. For mass battle resolution I use the OD&D War Machine, which has the right level of abstraction, but I'd love a good GM's aid to help put over the _feel_ of being in a mass battle. I'm definitely not looking for player-oriented stuff like feats & prestige classes, what I'd be interested in would be stuff like encounter tables, encounters and pocket scenarios during a battle for low, mid, high and epic level PCs, lots of advice on how to run scenarios with different kinds of battlefields - sieges, assaults, small battles with a few thousand combatants, huge battles with hundreds of thousands, extra-planar and other magical battlefields, that kind of thing. Advice on how to evoke the feel/mood of a particular battle - WW1 mass slaughter, Arthurian chivalry, Conanesque blood & gore. This is not the kind of thing I've seen before from WoTC and it would be fantastic if they paid attention to the 'fluff' this time.
 

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