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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Medic" data-source="post: 8741953" data-attributes="member: 7035835">Orcus has been the main villain of this thread, so let's dissect this demon prince (in 5th Edition, since this is a 5e thread).The Lord of the Undead has a +10 to Dexterity saves, a +15 to Constitution saves, and a +13 to Wisdom saves. Already he's shrugging off most of the spells that a level 20 Wizard can throw his way, who "only" has a spell save DC of 18, meaning that Orcus will succeed against more than half of the wizard's spells (unless you're using one of a select few that target a less common save). But wait, there's more! Like any greater demon, he has innate Magic Resistance (Advantage on saves against spells and magical effects) to bolster his defenses even further, making it incredibly unlikely that he'll fail during a fight even if he rolls poorly. And in the unlikely event that he somehow does fail a save against Disintegrate or Polymorph, he has Legendary Resistance to fall back on and can simply choose to succeed a saving throw instead of failing three times a day. The "good stuff" that casters used to have (No-Save Spells, a veritable truckload of powerful summons) are also notably absent in 5th Edition. Taken altogether, a high-level Wizard is largely impotent in a one-on-one against the demon prince.He's also resistant to Cold, Fire and Lightning, and immune to Necrotic, four of the most common magical damage types, and totally immune to the Charmed and Frightened conditions. Great. With his wand (which he should obviously have), he can also cast Blight at-will, cast Finger of Death 7 times, and whip up 500 hit points' worth of undead (that's two adult blue dracoliches, who also have legendary resistance, legendary actions, flying speed, high attack bonuses, high saves...) as an action once per day. Last but certainly not least are his Legendary Actions and Lair actions, which can be "annoying," to say the least.Here's how this fight would actually play out: the Wizard and Cleric can't actually kill or disable Orcus or his dracoliches with their magic, so they have to focus on mitigating the damage and keeping the rest of the party buffed up and alive while the Paladin and Rogue are saddled with the unpleasant task of chewing through a meat wall of nearly 900 combined hit points with their weapons. I'm not really a fan of this design, but it's not like the casters would flex their magic muscles through the fight while martials would have to twiddle their thumbs and look on jealously in such a scenario. Both have their roles that need to be fulfilled.</blockquote>

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