"Best" Shaman to date IYHO?

[Ham_Slaad]

Curious to know what people think of the many many versions of the Shaman that are out there and which one they think is:

1) Best overall in terms of balance, flava, etc. Can be any interpretation.

2) Best for a Bronze Age campaign where they will be the emissaries between the Mortal Realms and the Spirit Realms.

Just curious.

Thanks!

EDIT: As one poster already pointed out, there may not be a difference between #1 and #2; just wanted to find out some different takes on this class that I might not have heard of.

 

[Psion]

I'm not going to really draw a distinction in the two.

I think Mongoose's version and Green Ronin's version both have a lot going for them. They both use the common idea that different spirits are represented by different domains.

For the busy GM, I'd lean a bit more towards the Green Ronin book, as it takes less effort to use. You can pretty much drop the book into the game and it's ready to run. The Shaman is more standardized and fits fairly well with existing classes, while capturing many intriguing shamanic concepts such as "diseases as spirits."

Mongoose's ED: Shamans is more customizable, but it relies more on this customization. These shamans have no default spell list and rely entirely on the DM to detail the shaman's spirit allies (which is no mean feat, having done it one I can say.) Further, the way the domain abilities works in the ED Shaman system doesn't work so well for some domain abilities.


I find most other shamans (Kenzer, Open World, OA, etc.) to be pale shadows of these two or simple druid or cleric knock offs. You get more flavor with the Green Ronin or Mongoose shamans.

 

[Olive]

What sort of flavour would you describe the Mongoose and GR shamans as having? I've been interested in a shaman for a while, but haven't pursued it as it hasn't been an inpending issue. But I want a norse/celtic feel, not a native american one.

 

[Campbell]

What sort of flavour would you describe the Mongoose and GR shamans as having? I've been interested in a shaman for a while, but haven't pursued it as it hasn't been an inpending issue. But I want a norse/celtic feel, not a native american one.

I could see the OA Shaman working for you if you got rid of their Unarmed Strikes and set up a culturally appropriate list of bonus feats. I've taken the eye to a few other Shaman classes, but the spell list in OA is what really caught my eye. Beyond the hand-to-hand aspect, and grappling based bonus feats it really seemed to be culture nuetral, and those things can be changed pretty easily.

 

[Nightfall]

I think what Psion is saying is these shamans deal more in spiritual aspects. OA Shaman is a little too similiar to cleric even though it has less in common with it. So that's what I'm reading. My advice, read Psion's review.

 

[Silveras]

What sort of flavour would you describe the Mongoose and GR shamans as having? I've been interested in a shaman for a while, but haven't pursued it as it hasn't been an inpending issue. But I want a norse/celtic feel, not a native american one.

I can't speak about the Mongoose one, but I have used the Green Ronin.

The GR Shaman is very much an animist feel. It lends itself most easily to the Native American style/flavor.

I plan to adapt it, however, for norse-flavor use by allowing the selection of standard gods as the "totem spirits" as the class progresses.

GR's shaman is also a spontaneous spellcaster, by the way, so if you are considering using the Spontaneous Divine Casters from Unearthed Arcana, you may wind up losing a lot of this class' distinction.

To the original point, I like the GR Shaman. It fits well, and the book has a good guide to Shamanic traditions in different cultures (and how to guide the Shaman class to accomplish them), as well as "how to have Shamans without adding another class if you don't want to" (using Druids and/or Clerics).

The OA Shaman does seem more of a cleric-like flavor than the GR Shaman. I tend to favor the GR Shaman for more primitive cultures and the OA Shaman for the more advanced ones.

 

[Psion]

Er, yeah, what they said. The GR and Mongoose shamans have a Native American or East Asian animist feel to them, though I'd peg GR as being a little more towards the Native American feel in that I think some of its spirit oriented spells seem like they fit the Native American notion of a "vision quest."

As for Norse or Celtic feel, that's really not what I associate with the Shaman. If I were going for norse feel, I'd use the rune mage from Bastion's Spells & Magic.

GR's shaman is also a spontaneous spellcaster, by the way

The Mongoose shaman is, too.

The OA Shaman does seem more of a cleric-like flavor than the GR Shaman. I tend to favor the GR Shaman for more primitive cultures and the OA Shaman for the more advanced ones.

In my OA game, I used the OA shaman for psuedo-Buddhist priests/Bonze and the Mongoose shaman for animists in the vein of Chinese animism and Shinto priests/Shinsoku.

In my standard game, I use the GR Shaman for the eastern culture which has some animist leanings.

 

[Ed Cha]

I find most other shamans (Kenzer, Open World, OA, etc.) to be pale shadows of these two or simple druid or cleric knock offs. You get more flavor with the Green Ronin or Mongoose shamans.

Thanks for mentioning the OWP shaman class that can be found in "World of Whitethorn 1A: The Hamlet of Thumble". That shaman is designed to be a very generic, fit-for-any-campaign class and follows standard class formats found in the PHB. So that's why you might think it is like a cleric or druid knockoff.

In some ways, it is kind of like a primitive cleric with some druid-like abilities, but there are also some interesting special abilities (turn or rebuke spirits, chant, craft fetish, animal spirits, ritual sacrifice, etc) and spells (omen, drowsiness, shrinking head, savage strike, howling wind, etc).

Some folks like the ritual sacrifice class ability granted at 12th (1/day), 16th (2/day), and 20th (3/day) levels which allows the shaman to sacrifice any living creature of a different alignment and gain one extra hit point per hit die for a number of hours equal to his Wisdom modifier. It's two hit points per hit die at 16th and 3 hit points per hit die at 20th.

Here's a pic of the shaman class:

http://www.openworldpress.com/images/17_shaman.jpeg

For more information, go to the OWP Web site:

http://www.openworldpress.com

 

[Turjan]

I like both, the Green Ronin and the Mongoose takes on Shamans. If one of the books were bad the decision would be easier . Although, being lazy, I mostly go with the Green Ronin one. It's a very good book, anyway .

As for Norse or Celtic feel, that's really not what I associate with the Shaman. If I were going for norse feel, I'd use the rune mage from Bastion's Spells & Magic.

Do you use the class as is, i.e., as a prestige class with these odd requirements, or did you transfer it to a base class?

 

[ManicFuel]

IMC, I use GRs Shaman and Witch classes in "norse" areas interchangeably. The Witch's Handbook has some good info on ritual spellcasting, and times/places of power that I felt were appropriate to a shaman as well. Both are easy to integrate. The classes are more gritty than flashy, are healers, community helpers and diviners.

What exactly constitutes a "norse/celtic" feel for a shaman?