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Best Star Wars RPG?

Which is the best official Star Wars RPG?

  • WEG d6

    Votes: 107 38.9%
  • WotC d20 System

    Votes: 20 7.3%
  • WotC SAGA Edition

    Votes: 77 28.0%
  • FFG Edge of the Empire (etc.)

    Votes: 71 25.8%

bone_naga

Explorer
Okay, so the rules for force-users weren't only in the later supplement Force and Destiny?
Rules for force-users were in edge of the Empire and Age of Rebellion. You won't be a Jedi Academy graduate with those rules, though, more like pre-Dagobah Luke. A full-blown Jedi Knight doesn't really fit in a campaign of rogues at the fringes of Imperial control or in the Rebel Alliance. For some of us, that works just fine.

Also, I take "core rules" to mean all the rules needed to play the game, not every class/profession that will ever be included, so I think I misunderstood. That may just be because I'm normally a D&D player and I'm used to additional classes being released in later books. So long as I can run a full campaign off the core books, I'm good with it. Of course, D&D also makes you buy 3 core books just to have the information you need to run a campaign.

Now for people that just want all the classes together so they can mix and match as they please, yeah I can see that being a little frustrating. The books aren't cheap and the core rules remain the same, so you are basically paying for some of the same material 3 times over if you want all three core books. FFG should consider consolidating them into a single book in the future. My guess is that if it happens, it won't be until after sales start to drop, unfortunately.

My understanding is that FFG's materials are more restricted to the movies
Yes and no. Obviously you can take the rules and apply them to whatever setting you want. A smuggler during the Galactic Empire could just as easily be a smuggler during the Galactic Alliance.

But like I said above, there is obviously an intended setting for each book and you are correct that it is during the original trilogy. AoR and EotE both take place between A New Hope and Empire Strikes Back. It doesn't even include EU material by default (there's a short section basically saying it's up to the GM whether or not to include it, but that's about it). I haven't really looked too much at the third book. I would assume they take place either before or after the original trilogy, during a time when Jedi were common enough that having Jedi characters running around doesn't break canon (assuming you're concerned with that).
 

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Also, I take "core rules" to mean all the rules needed to play the game, not every class/profession that will ever be included, so I think I misunderstood. That may just be because I'm normally a D&D player and I'm used to additional classes being released in later books. So long as I can run a full campaign off the core books, I'm good with it. Of course, D&D also makes you buy 3 core books just to have the information you need to run a campaign.

Okay, if you're new to Star Wars RPG's, here's a bit of comparison to how the prior editions ran things.

Both WEG and WotC Star Wars had everything you'd need to run in one book. WEG only had the Rebellion and New Republic eras in existence when they were published, but they did at least touch on New Republic materials in their later core book (2nd Edition Revised and Expanded). WotC made sure to have support for the prequel/Clone Wars era in their core books (to the limit of the films that had been produced at the time), and included at least bare-bones stats for the New Republic and New Jedi Order eras in their core books.

WEG had everything you'd need to make pretty much any character in the core rules. Later books added rare or highly specialized skills (Brainwashing was in the Truce at Bakura sourcebook, for example), and when later books or comics would have force powers not seen before they would be covered in the sourcebook for that book/comic (also, one of the later books, the Tales of the Jedi Companion, the sourcebook for Old Republic-era play, included every single force power in one book. However, the core rules were sure to include every force power from the actual movies and a few from outside the movies in it. You could create anything from a raw trooper or Luke-training-under-Kenobi all the way up to Yoda, Vader and Palpatine from the core rules (although more detailed rules for martial arts were in a later sourcebook focusing on special forces, and the official stats for Yoda and Palpatine included some of the force powers from later books, but you certainly didn't need them to run most encounters)

WotC did make their initial two editions of Star Wars to be very similar and compatible with D&D, to the point that I know people who ran crossovers with only mild conversions (importing D&D monsters to be creatures in Star Wars, or using Star Wars rules to represent people from the future or a technological civilization). They had all the basic classes in there (Soldier, Scoundrel, Scout, Noble, Fringer, Jedi Consular, Jedi Guardian, and they added Tech Specialist as a core class in the Revised Core Rules edition), and some prestige classes (Bounty Hunter, Officer, Elite Trooper, Starfighter Ace, and made Jedi Master a Prestige Class in the Revised rules, where previously being a Knight or Master worked like old-school D&D level titles, where you became a Knight at 7th level and a Master (or Sith Lord) at 13th level).

Yes, WotC produced LOTS of prestige classes for d20 Star Wars, but they were often very redundant. You didn't need the Imperial Moff class to represent a Moff, when they could easily be modeled as a multiclass Noble/Soldier, maybe with the Officer PrC. You didn't need the Naval Officer class when there was already the Officer PrC in the core rules, and so on.

You could create anything from a new padawan or Luke-under-Kenobi as a 1st Level Jedi Guardian or Jedi Consular, all the way up to Yoda or Palpatine (20th level characters, although Palpatine was a multiclassed Noble 3/Jedi Consular 17 under the first version of his stats). The Jedi classes were also used for representing Sith too, since it's a very similar skill set, and even in the movies Qui-Gon refers to Darth Maul as "well trained in the Jedi arts". A later sourcebook added several Sith-specific PrC's, but you didn't have to have them to create Sith.

So, all the prior Star Wars RPG's included rules to create everything from new Jedi all the way to Knights and Masters (or Sith Apprentices and Lords), and support for all the basic character archetypes in one single book of their core rules, and included at least token support of the various eras that existed beyond the movies at that point.

It doesn't even include EU material by default (there's a short section basically saying it's up to the GM whether or not to include it, but that's about it). I haven't really looked too much at the third book. I would assume they take place either before or after the original trilogy, during a time when Jedi were common enough that having Jedi characters running around doesn't break canon (assuming you're concerned with that).

Yeah, I'm a huge fan of the EU, and still rather grumpy (if not outright bitter) at the treatment of the EU under Disney. I'm also a fan of canon, so my games tend to stick fairly close to the canonical Star Wars (or, what was recognized as canon before April 2014). The fact that the EU was basically created originally for the d6 RPG to flesh out the setting beyond the movies to the point that it could be a viable gaming setting really ties Star Wars RPG's and the Expanded Universe together rather closely.
 

bone_naga

Explorer
I still have d6 books sitting around so I get what you mean, it's just been a while since I played any d6 stuff and I've become more accustomed to the D&D model.

For the EU, Lucas did say from the start that he will probably ignore EU material if there are any new movies, so I'm not surprised by it getting scrapped. Plus so much ground had already been covered over such a large period of time that it didn't leave much room for new stories. Now I certainly wouldn't have minded seeing the Thrawn Trilogy on screen, but let's be honest, some of the other EU material was nowhere near as good.

Personally, I'd rather keep at least a good bit of the EU and scrap the prequel trilogy, but that's just me.
 

Queer Venger

Dungeon Master is my Daddy
No.

I was getting tired of having to buy new editions of Star Wars by the time Saga Edition came out. I've got shelves full of d6 books, every single book published for the d20 version, and about half of the Saga Edition books. . .and I was really getting tired of it by Saga Edition. Buying several new books to try a new game (since the core rules are apparently spread out among different books, like D&D, and unlike prior Star Wars games) isn't for me.

I like how fairly rules-light d6 is and how flexible it is. I like how I've been able to teach people with no prior gaming experience how to play it in less than 5 minutes and how I've had people who normally hate RPG's as being too rule/math intense play it and like it.

FFG going to the trouble of spreading out the rules for things like force users away from the main rules just seems like a patently obvious cash grab, then special dice on top of that? No.

Then hearing that starting force-users are that weak? All in the name of game balance? (Game balance has very little place in Star Wars, this isn't D&D. Model the setting not the idea that all characters have to be mechanically equal) So I guess a Clone-Wars era game with PC's starting as Padawans is right out. WotC followed that canard of game balance, but they at least set starting characters at the point that a starting force-user could have the basic skill set and equipment of a young Jedi.

I understand that it's got people voting for it now, it's the current game, it's the one that's got hype and "support" and people go to their FLGS and see the shiny new thing on the shelf.

People said the same thing about Saga Edition when it was out, and people said that about the d20 OCR and RCR rules when they were out too.

Me? I'll be fine with my d6 rules, and converting things from the d20/Saga versions back to d6.

Then again, I'm also similarly cynical and uninterested at the Disney reboot of Star Wars, so I'm not one to just jump on something because it's got hype and a marketing blitz behind it. The moment they labelled the Star Wars I'd known and loved for 20+ years as "Legends" and talked about how "Legends" wasn't the real Star Wars (unlike their new stuff), I realized I was probably done buying new Star Wars stuff.

As they say in Game of Thrones, " you know nothing John Snow" ;-)
 

I still have d6 books sitting around so I get what you mean, it's just been a while since I played any d6 stuff and I've become more accustomed to the D&D model.

For the EU, Lucas did say from the start that he will probably ignore EU material if there are any new movies, so I'm not surprised by it getting scrapped. Plus so much ground had already been covered over such a large period of time that it didn't leave much room for new stories. Now I certainly wouldn't have minded seeing the Thrawn Trilogy on screen, but let's be honest, some of the other EU material was nowhere near as good.

Personally, I'd rather keep at least a good bit of the EU and scrap the prequel trilogy, but that's just me.

George Lucas said repeatedly after the Prequels he was done forever with Star Wars movies, in 2009 he even publicly said he had put it in his will that there would be no new SW movies, ever and his heirs would be prohibited by the terms they were being willed Star Wars from making more movies with it. George Lucas didn't say one word about doing another movie series set after RotJ after the early 1980's, until after the Disney deal was closed, and even then he said that even if he wanted to, he wouldn't because he was too old to do another trilogy.

Lucasfilm went out of their way to minimize contradictions between the EU and the prequels, like how EU authors were prohibited from writing anything about the rise of the Emperor and the Clone Wars and how the Jedi Order fell, and the most they could do was vague references, because Lucas said he wanted to tell those stories himself one day and didn't want to contradict them, and he didn't mind people writing stories set after RotJ, because he wasn't going to make films there (and even then, he still exercised oversight of those stories).

Also, there was plenty of room in the EU for new adventures in movies. Take where the current edge of the main Expanded Universe timeline in 45 ABY. Jump the timeline ahead a few years, you can have Ben Skywalker as a protagonist, there's room for Jaina Solo to play the Leia/Padme-esque role, we could see the rise of the Fel Dynasty, we could deal with surviving members of the Lost Tribe of Sith, or someone from the One Sith who was lurking around messing things up. There were a lot of ways the story could easily go from there.

The canon of the EU didn't constrain things, it enabled them. It added a lot of verisimilitude, it made Star Wars feel like a real "lived in" universe and not just a series of movies.

I would have even accepted Disney keeping the EU, what they now call "Legends" as an alternate continuity, but instead they cancelled EU works that were in progress like Sword of the Jedi and Star Wars: 1313, and made press releases about how there was only one Star Wars canon and it was their new canon they were releasing.

Me? I'm keeping the entire EU, ignoring the The Clone Wars TV series and The Force Unleashed II, and totally ignoring everything Disney is making now. I'm actively refusing to go see their movies when they come in theaters as a protest about how they've treated the Expanded Universe.
 

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