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Message: <blockquote data-quote="Cheiromancer" data-source="post: 3191059" data-attributes="member: 141">[PLAIN][Blast], [?] and [Destroy][/PLAIN]Back to [blast].I was thinking about the no-save rays (like polar ray or scorching ray) and how they are related to this seed.  I think that changing the base damage to 20d6 will work well enough to handle the "no save factor".  It's really an exponential factor, so I think it should change the base damage rather than be a straight plus of some sort.  "No save" would be cost effective if the opposition is saving more than 2/3 of the time.So a no-save area effect (rather like a high level ice storm) would do 20d6 at SP 24. If made into a ray (at -6, as per my suggestion in the <a href="https://www.enworld.org/index.php?threads/181022/" target="_blank">Mass Effect Factors</a> thread) then you could pay for an Empower factor and do 30d6 as an elemental ray. This compares nicely, in both range and damage, to a polar ray (which does 21d6 at 21st level).I would also suggest a base damage reduction to make a spell into a no SR conjuration.  This changes the school, so probably should be a different seed.  I don't know what it would be called.  But a 20d6 no SR area effect seems reasonable. There should be a way to get clouds in there too.  Clouds are funny, though; they typically do less damage but for a longer time.  Incendiary cloud does 4d6 for 1 round/level, reflex half, and can be moved by concentration.  Make it 5d6 and a free action to move and it could plausibly be called an epic spell.  Not exactly a heavy hitter, but [blast] is itself a bit of a light-weight.  Clouds can be combined with other seeds to apply poison (cloud kill) and probably stuff like disease and negative levels too.  I don't know - no SR says "conjuration" to me, but aside from the change in base damage (and the possible addition of clouds as an effect) it seems kind of a modest basis for a seed.    Which reminds me...Re: DisintegrateIf you don't expect the opposition to make their saves very often, I'd suggest a skew factor at +4 SP.  A skew spell does double the base damage on a failed save, but only 5d6 on a successful save. This factor can only be used on an effect that allows a saving throw. Skew is based on disintegrate, of course, and adding it to [blast] would be tantamount to subsuming [destroy] entirely.  I think it would be nice to preserve [destroy] as a separate seed, but it seems to be only about two factors different from [blast]; skew, for the odd damage profile, and another factor (+4?) that allows it to take down force fields and anti-magic shells and epic wards and such.  (If this factor is more expensive, then the skew factor might have to be correspondingly cheaper; my calculations supposed that they summed to +8. And I assumed that the spread to ray toggle was valued at 6.)Two factors seems to be a slim basis on which to build a seed.  What do you think?</blockquote>

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