Bloodline Levels from UA

[JVisgaitis]

I'm just curious what everyone's take is on bloodline levels from Unearthed Arcana. There was some talk in another thread about the new racial substitution levels in Races of Stone and Races of Destiny and someone pointed me to the Bloodline Levels in UA. The way the balance for these is done is odd to me. While you get perks at lower levels and they are designed to not allow you to ignore the bloodline, I just don't like the idea of taking a level for nothing but a few abilities. What does everyone else think? Anyone ever try these?

 

[JRRNeiklot]

I think they are interesting, but weak, with the possible exception of the fire elemental and titan bloodlines. Fire elementals gives you +1 dex, dodge, mobility, spring attack, and a few other minor perks for the price of two levels. Not bad. Titan bloodline lets you use fricking huge weapons. Overall, unless you have a particular character concept, I don't think it's worth it.

 

[Crothian]

I really like the idea, but think they would have been better as templates or something like that.

 

[Barendd Nobeard]

I am using the Vampire bloodline for my Eberron rogue. It's quite fun.

I'm using the major bloodline, so I'll lose three levels altogether (eventually). But for that loss, I get three stat bumps, four feats, four skill boosts, two Resistances, natural armor, some spells, and damage reduction (and "vampire affinity" which will probably not be very useful). All this, assuming he makes it to level 20.

For a rogue, I don't mind the trade-off. For a spellcaster, I would never give up three caster levels for that kind of trade-off.

 

[irdeggman]

I really like the idea, but think they would have been better as templates or something like that.

But I think the whole idea was to create a system that can progess without a sudden LA. What I mean it is possible to play a 1st level character with this system and progressively gain abilities that would normally translate into a LA.

This appears to be the newest 'standard' for WotC (see the threads they did when they posted level progressions for every LA race and template in the DMG and MM), that is to present systems where LA races, templates, etc. can be gained at 1st level and still have the character be a 1st level character and thus 'balanced' with other characters. This concept I think is really good because it makes all the players feel like they are starting out even and not that the player who wants to play a drow at first level while the other players are forced to play a 1st level human or elf gains an advantage over the other players. If this type of thing (class levels to account for LA for races and templates) is not done then players will feel cheated. IMO that is what 'balance' is about, making sure that no player feels cheated in the process.

 

[Cheiromancer]

I find it hard to believe that anyone would pay the LA for those bloodlines. I thought they were intended to be used with the LA buyoff on the facing page.

Mind-you, the LA buyoff is too good, but I could see a DM using it *only* for bloodlines. I.e. instead of rising to 4th level, you lose that level's xp, so you have a the minimum xp for 3rd level; that's how you pay for the bloodline. Then they are fairly priced.

 

[Laman Stahros]

For a rogue, I don't mind the trade-off. For a spellcaster, I would never give up three caster levels for that kind of trade-off.

I'm using them in my campaign and you don't lose caster levels for bloodlines. The levels that you take to pay for bloodline abilities count towards any and all spellcasting classes that you have for level based abilities - including caster level (ref. page 19, last two paragraphs on the bottom right and first two on page 20 , top left).

 

[Squire James]

One of my PC's tried the Celestial bloodline with his character, and both of us consider it pretty weak. I think they would have worked better as "bloodline substitution levels", where all the abilities are granted at the same time each +1 to LA occurs.

The "magic levels" would be 3rd, 6th, and 12th (add 18th and 24th for particularly potent bloodlines). If the character doesn't take a substitution level at the proper time, the character is assumed to have manifested all his bloodline abilities and cannot "go back" and change later. Some bloodlines would stop at +1 LA, while others may go up to +4 or +5 LA. At any rate, the bloodline should be about as powerful as the LA suggests.

For example, a Celestial bloodline would start as a LA +1 race with Aasimar-like powers to people who gave up 3rd level to his bloodline. As he gives up levels at 6th, 12th, and finally 18th, he morphs into a Half-Celestial (which happens to be a LA +4 template).

The player doesn't even have to be aware of his heritage at character creation, the DM can simply bring up the notion when the PC's about to turn 3rd level and let him choose whether or not he "accepts his heritage". If he doesn't, the PC remains a normal member of the original race and the heritage is "pure fluff". If he accepts, his heritage gains a little "crunch", perhaps developing into a lot of "crunch" later.