Bloodlines

[Roman]

Unearthed Arcana introduced the concept of Bloodlines. I really like the concept and have two questions:

1) As much as I like the concept of bloodlines I dislike the 'affinity' bonuses that the bloodlines grant. Has anybody replaced these with something else and if so with what? If not, what with would you recommend to replace the affinity bonuses?

2) I really like the concept that a bloodline or race continues to affects characters' abilities and grant or improve new ones as the characters advance in levels. Hence I am wondering if anybody has created bloodlines for the standard PHB races ? I understand that this was not the intention of bloodlines, but the mechanic lends itself for this purpose too. I doubt anybody has done this, but it is no harm to ask.

 

[Roman]

I have another question related to bloodlines in their original meaning (as opposed to bloodlines as mechanical tools to make core race choice continue to impact abilities of characters as they advance like I mentioned in my second question) in Unearthed Arcana. What proportion of blood would be sufficient to grant a bloodline to the character in your opinion (I know it is left undefined in the book, but what do you think)?

I have a feeling it would be approximately the following:

1 - fully the race/creature
3/4 - template or race
1/2 - template or race
1/4 - template or major bloodline or moderate bloodline or minor bloodline (the highest bloodline allowed) or major feat-chain
1/8 - moderate bloodline or minor bloodline (the second highest bloodline allowed [if any]) or moderate feat-chain
1/16 - minor bloodline (the third highest bloodline allowed [if any]) or minor feat-chain
1/32 - feat
1/64 or less - roleplaying effects only (if any effects at all)

 

[Roman]

Hmm, I am thinking that the affinity bonus might as well become a skill bonus to one skill, but I am not sure if it would be balanced.

 

[Rystil Arden]

I like your numbers on the fractional races; they nearly match my own. As for the affinity bonuses, I don't like them because it means some bloodline guy can Diplomacy things with whom they share a tiny bit of blood better than the actual things can amongst themselves. I replace the affinities haphazardly with a few other minor abilities depending on the race and my whims.

 

[Roman]

I like your numbers on the fractional races; they nearly match my own.

Just out of interest - how do your fractional races work?

As for the affinity bonuses, I don't like them because it means some bloodline guy can Diplomacy things with whom they share a tiny bit of blood better than the actual things can amongst themselves. I replace the affinities haphazardly with a few other minor abilities depending on the race and my whims.

That is precisely the same reason why I dislike the affinities and want to replace them with something else. Any suggestions as to what would make a good replacement?

 

[Rystil Arden]

Just out of interest - how do your fractional races work?



That is precisely the same reason why I dislike the affinities and want to replace them with something else. Any suggestions as to what would make a good replacement?

My fractions are exactly the same, except that I use templates for 1/4 and majour bloodlines for any fraction in between 1/4 and 1/8 for strong blood and majour bloodlines for 1/4 for weak blood (whereas your chart might eliminate majour bloodlines altogether for strong blood). If you're wondering if number between 1/8 and 1/4 every come up, I do wind up with 3/16 fey a bunch in my post-Arthurian campaign.

As for the affinities, I replace them with the random cool abilities that I would have put into the bloodline if I were designing them, and generally in a very specific manner. By specific, I mean I make it different depending on the exact race of the ancestors if the category is broad (like fey, which is one of the main ones I use). So Nia, the daughter of Nimue and Merlin, is 3/8 siren, 2/8 dark-sidhe, 3/8 human. If it weren't for the fact that she was already half-fey template, her Bloodline traits would have included a bonus to Charisma-based skill checks that involved her voice, and a +1 to the caster level of her shadow spells.

 

[Roman]

My fractions are exactly the same, except that I use templates for 1/4 and majour bloodlines for any fraction in between 1/4 and 1/8 for strong blood and majour bloodlines for 1/4 for weak blood (whereas your chart might eliminate majour bloodlines altogether for strong blood). If you're wondering if number between 1/8 and 1/4 every come up, I do wind up with 3/16 fey a bunch in my post-Arthurian campaign.

Interesting. As a side note, I currently play as a player in an Arthurian campaign (even has a story hour on these boards).

As for the affinities, I replace them with the random cool abilities that I would have put into the bloodline if I were designing them, and generally in a very specific manner. By specific, I mean I make it different depending on the exact race of the ancestors if the category is broad (like fey, which is one of the main ones I use). So Nia, the daughter of Nimue and Merlin, is 3/8 siren, 2/8 dark-sidhe, 3/8 human. If it weren't for the fact that she was already half-fey template, her Bloodline traits would have included a bonus to Charisma-based skill checks that involved her voice, and a +1 to the caster level of her shadow spells.

That is certainly more flavourful than coming up with a generic fix, but it is harder to balance. On the other hand, the bloodlines are probably somewhat underpowered so taking some liberties here cannot hurt that much.

 

[Rystil Arden]

Interesting. As a side note, I currently play as a player in an Arthurian campaign (even has a story hour on these boards).



That is certainly more flavourful than coming up with a generic fix, but it is harder to balance. On the other hand, the bloodlines are probably somewhat underpowered so taking some liberties here cannot hurt that much.

Ah, my campaign is Post-Arthurian. A new generation of heroes takes up arms against the Saxons, to see how long they can hold them off...and in the darkness, a large number of Neutral and Evil entities grab for power, including a dark cult from long agoa nd far away about which the characters are sometimes having flashbacks and prophetic dreams. Not to mention the dark assassin who they can never seem to shake...

The bloodlines are definitely underpowered just a tad, and I personally pride myself on being able to balance just about anything for my own campaign on the fly (although that doesn't mean they are balanced for everyone). I also have a lot of fun doing it (for instance, I came up with several cool prestige classes and NPCs that the players might never meet).

 

[Roman]

Ah, my campaign is Post-Arthurian. A new generation of heroes takes up arms against the Saxons, to see how long they can hold them off...and in the darkness, a large number of Neutral and Evil entities grab for power, including a dark cult from long agoa nd far away about which the characters are sometimes having flashbacks and prophetic dreams. Not to mention the dark assassin who they can never seem to shake...

Heh, the campaign I am in is set about 15 years before the end of the Arthurian era. The quest for the Holy Grail is on, but a whole bunch of things is happening simultaneously. Our party is based in Ireland - a very clever move by the DM - since it means we are somewhat distanced from the main events of the Arthurian legends yet the flavour is the same and they still happen in the background. It is a very good campaign. It is an interesting conincidence that you mentioned fey bloodlines, as my character, Sir Anton, died last session (in the spirit of the Arthurian setting as a noble knight he would not accept help from friends in combat), but was reincarnated as an elf (and elves are fey in this campaign), so it has some direct relevance.

As to the campaign I run myself, it is not Arthurian. My campaign is a homebrew that liberaly steals from many periods of history, legend, myth, etc. There are several basic underlying themes, though:

1) There is one dominant empire (called Altier) that rules most of the known world, but after a process of decay for several decades it is now undergoing collapse with some regions in rebellion and many others being only nominally controlled by Altier. Altier is to a significant degree modelled on the Roman Empire with themes from the Napoleonic Empire and the Russian Empire also making an appearance as well as some medieval themes being present.
2) Nationalism plays an important role in the campaign world in this era.
3) The whole world is based on ages, which stretch a long way back. The current age is now drawing to a close and a new age is emerging. What form the new age will take will be something the players will be able to influence. Every age also has a metaphisical impact on the world.

The bloodlines are definitely underpowered just a tad, and I personally pride myself on being able to balance just about anything for my own campaign on the fly (although that doesn't mean they are balanced for everyone). I also have a lot of fun doing it (for instance, I came up with several cool prestige classes and NPCs that the players might never meet).

I too love coming up with new concepts for my campaign even if I do not use them (sometimes I do and sometimes I do not). Unfortunately, I am not that good at balancing...

 

[Rystil Arden]

Heh, the campaign I am in is set about 15 years before the end of the Arthurian era. The quest for the Holy Grail is on, but a whole bunch of things is happening simultaneously. Our party is based in Ireland - a very clever move by the DM - since it means we are somewhat distanced from the main events of the Arthurian legends yet the flavour is the same and they still happen in the background. It is a very good campaign. It is an interesting conincidence that you mentioned fey bloodlines, as my character, Sir Anton, died last session (in the spirit of the Arthurian setting as a noble knight he would not accept help from friends in combat), but was reincarnated as an elf (and elves are fey in this campaign), so it has some direct relevance.

As to the campaign I run myself, it is not Arthurian. My campaign is a homebrew that liberaly steals from many periods of history, legend, myth, etc. There are several basic underlying themes, though:

1) There is one dominant empire (called Altier) that rules most of the known world, but after a process of decay for several decades it is now undergoing collapse with some regions in rebellion and many others being only nominally controlled by Altier. Altier is to a significant degree modelled on the Roman Empire with themes from the Napoleonic Empire and the Russian Empire also making an appearance as well as some medieval themes being present.
2) Nationalism plays an important role in the campaign world in this era.
3) The whole world is based on ages, which stretch a long way back. The current age is now drawing to a close and a new age is emerging. What form the new age will take will be something the players will be able to influence. Every age also has a metaphisical impact on the world.



I too love coming up with new concepts for my campaign even if I do not use them (sometimes I do and sometimes I do not). Unfortunately, I am not that good at balancing...

Fey are majourly important in my campaign, since a good number of important NPCs are part-fey. The PCs have spent a good deal of time in Ireland, and they went to Pictland and Wales, and are planning a voyage to Aiaia (Kirke's home in the Mediterranean), although they are going to Ireland right now to commune with the Tuatha de Danaan. All my Arthurian and Celtic research (Fenian Cycle, Mabinogion, Book of Invasions, Chretien de Troyes, Nennias, Geoffrey of Monmouth, Marie de France, and more ).

Fey are cool. I made a large number of different half-fey templates too (Nia has her own, and its different than Selene's [Morgaine le Fay's daughter]). I'd be happy to share anything of mine with you.

Your homebrew sounds cool; it sounds like the WoT, which is a great setting. I have a few homebrew worlds too, with fun stuff going on like that.