Blue Fire Giant

[Axe11154]

"Many years ago, too long to count for most mortals or even remember, two powers fell in love: A storm with a volcano, and the volcano a storm. While others saw their love as cursed they themselves could not care for they had each other. Through the seasons their love grew, till one day they had a child, a small island whos heat was that of the sun. They saw the child as perfect, and brought it to the mother of earth for blessing, who saw how beautiful the child was and blessed it with magic to craft what ever toy it wished. As the blessing ended sadly the mother of earths husband, the Father in Haven, saw the child and only saw a monster. The pair fought with the Father in Haven, begging him to spare the child, but all he had in his heart was anger for he felt their union was a betrayal of creation. With a massive hurricane he absorbed the storm, and sank the volcano, next was the small island child who not even knew what life was. The Father in Haven was only stopped however by his wife!
"You may kill the storm and volcano, for they sinned against you, but it is the child who is pure and undeserving of the sin, please spare it, so it may spread the power of your wrath.".
The Father in Haven agreed, but cursed the child, so it would never know the love of its parents, and so the toys it made with the magic the mother of earth gave it would simply burn to ash. The Father in Haven called out!
"To all storms of haven, and volcanos of earth, the children you bare when in union shall be cursed the same, For I am the father who allows creation, and todo so against my law deserves only this!" " - An old story found in a bards college.

Outcasted by Father
Blue fire giants, Lumbering in height with skin grey like stone covered in dry cracks with hair white like clouds before they mass, are a rare and special sight. While not part of the ordning created by the All Father god of giants, they are protected by the goddess of earth, Othea. It is said they are born when royals of the fire and storm giants disobey the ordning, meeting with one another in secret to love. Sadly if this is true it seems their respective societies must see such children with distain as most blue fire giants are seen solitarily, in places far away from other giants and even further from societies. Its unknown if they can even produce young of their own as they have never been seen in pairs.

Brilliant craftsman, Horribly cursed
These giants have been seen and noted to have amazing crafting magic, that most in the people of other races would dream of, but with a minor catch. Their bodies produce a heat blistering heat that often burns, or melts the things they craft. Luckily they can use this magic at a distance away from them selves so they can still craft without harming their creation, however it is still sad to know they will never get to enjoy the things they make. Its almost like they have been cursed by the gods. No one knows where they gained this magic or how they know of it, as its clear no one taught it to them, the best most adventurers who have met them can tell, its just natural to them, like breathing.

 

[Cleon]

Okay, first impressions is I don't really care for the background info. It feels overly specific and restrictive to me. While it'd be fine for a campaign world where all the giants hew to the Law of the Ordnung, what about those that don't?

What if a campaign's giants have many different belief systems and cultures like, say, humans. The world's storm giants and fire giant polities might be so far away from each other (not to mention that one lives underwater and the other prefers volcanoes!) that they have little or nothing to do with each other.

It also seems odd that all unions of a Fire and a Storm results in one of these hybrids since their abilities are unusual and some of them are quite different from their giant parents. Wouldn't there be a bit more variation, with "firestorm giants" basically being black-skinned storm giants and others being fire giants who can breathe water, levitate or chuck lightning?

Their more unusual abilities are unlikely to be learnt from others of their kind since they're very rare and sterile to boot. There can't be "families" of Blue Fire Giants who teach their kids how to use Blue Fire Torch or Crafting Magic.

Mechanically, I'll have to think about it but at first glance the damage output seems slightly low (is that to compensate for the higher HP while keeping them Challenge 9?)

They average 43 damage (3d10+8 torch plus 3d6+8 fist), a CR 9 Fire Giant averages 56 (2 × 6d6+7 greatsword).

Although come to think on it, adding in the Burning Aura's 2d8 damage evens that out (52 vs 56 is close enough). Although if the opponents aren't wearing metal or have fire resistance/immunity prepped (which is quite possible if they know they'll be going into furnace lands) that won't count for much.

They could also do with a ranged attack - if ranged opponents attack them from more than 15 feet away there's no way for the Giant to respond (even their Burning Aura only has a 20 ft. range).

I'm also puzzled why they don't use weapons. They can employ Crafting Magic to make whatever lethal implement they like, and could also easily whip up a suit of plate armour with it (begging the question why they're only wearing splint).

So shouldn't they be armed?

Oh, and I feel the Saving Throw Proficiencies and Immunities/Resistances/Vulnerabilities look a bit excessive. Does it really need five Saves? If they're social outcasts would they have Charisma Save Proficiency? I'd be tempted to cut either the Dex or Wis proficiencies as well to give them three Proficiencies like a Fire Giant, but four Proficiencies seems acceptable to me.

Not sure about the Fire Immunity & Cold Vulnerability. The Storm Giant's Lightning & Thunder Immunities became Resistances in this hybrid, so wouldn't the Fire Giant's Fire Immunity also become a Resistance? That's make it hard to live in a volcanic fortress with normal Fire Giants, but the backstory suggests they wouldn't be allowed in the place anyway!

In closing, I'm curious why you made them Challenge 9 like their weaker Fire Giant parent. If I were whipping up a cross between a CR 9 Fire Giant and a CR 13 Storm Giant cross I'd probably average the two and aim for Challenge 11.

 

[aco175]

Is this more of a trick to fool the players? I recall a few Dungeon adventures with albino red dragons and such to trick the players into casting protection from cold and then, gotcha, you take fire.

The burning aura part is a bit unwieldly if it burns wood around you and turns stone to lava. You would have a hard time finding a place to live.

As a monster, it is ok and a bit of a scare to a party of 7th level PCs. With the vulnerable to cold things should be ok once the party figures out the trick.

 

[Blue Orange]

I think it was Dragon magazine #65 that had yellow, orange, and purple dragons. The purple breathed force (fire + lightning), and the green was the child of the previously undescribed yellow (salt) and the blue (lightning), the idea being that chlorine is made from the electrolysis of salt. The orange then breathed molten salt if I remember.

The 2e Draconomicon had rules for hybrid dragons, the examples were blue + red = purple and breathed electrified flame, and red + white = pink (it didn't say what the breath weapon was). They had tables to roll on for the hit dice and so on, this being 2e. You can have a lot of fun with the color wheel, with magenta dragons when a purple and a blue fall in love and so on.

I haven't seen giants before! I like it!

If it's the offspring of one storm and one fire giant, maybe it should be resistant (but not immune) to both fire and lightning?

 

[Cleon]

Is this more of a trick to fool the players? I recall a few Dungeon adventures with albino red dragons and such to trick the players into casting protection from cold and then, gotcha, you take fire.

The burning aura part is a bit unwieldly if it burns wood around you and turns stone to lava. You would have a hard time finding a place to live.

As a monster, it is ok and a bit of a scare to a party of 7th level PCs. With the vulnerable to cold things should be ok once the party figures out the trick.

No I don't think so.

It doesn't appear to have any immunities / special abilities that exploit any "mistaken the creature for a particular elemental subtype" factors.

Let's wait for Axe11154 to get back to indicate what their vision for this creature is.

 

[Cleon]

I think it was Dragon magazine #65 that had yellow, orange, and purple dragons. The purple breathed force (fire + lightning), and the green was the child of the previously undescribed yellow (salt) and the blue (lightning), the idea being that chlorine is made from the electrolysis of salt. The orange then breathed molten salt if I remember.

Yes, it was “The Return of the Missing Dragons” by Richard Alan Lloyd in Dragon #65 (June 1998).

The 2e Draconomicon had rules for hybrid dragons, the examples were blue + red = purple and breathed electrified flame, and red + white = pink (it didn't say what the breath weapon was). They had tables to roll on for the hit dice and so on, this being 2e. You can have a lot of fun with the color wheel, with magenta dragons when a purple and a blue fall in love and so on.

I haven't seen giants before! I like it!

I remember the various Dragon / subdragon hybrids from that source better, such as the creatures that were half-dragon, half-wyvern; or chimeras whose dragon heads where a different species than the standard Reds.

If it's the offspring of one storm and one fire giant, maybe it should be resistant (but not immune) to both fire and lightning?

Yes, that was my thinking. I'd have gone for Resistance to Fire, Lightning and Thunder and dropped the Cold.

 

[Axe11154]

@Cleon

"Okay, first impressions is I don't really care for the background info. It feels overly specific and restrictive to me. While it'd be fine for a campaign world where all the giants hew to the Law of the Ordnung, what about those that don't?

What if a campaign's giants have many different belief systems and cultures like, say, humans. The world's storm giants and fire giant polities might be so far away from each other (not to mention that one lives underwater and the other prefers volcanoes!) that they have little or nothing to do with each other."

Answer: Im just using the lore presented by the monster manual and volo's guide as a way to give a them a more cemented background. If I were to use my worlds rules on giants they would be alien to you and everyone else and require more explaining. If it comes to you using them you can use your own lore so it fits your world better. After all when it comes to homebrew we all use out own and replace what was there for the most part, this should be no different and lore arnt rules, more or less just guide lines.

"It also seems odd that all unions of a Fire and a Storm results in one of these hybrids since their abilities are unusual and some of them are quite different from their giant parents. Wouldn't there be a bit more variation, with "firestorm giants" basically being black-skinned storm giants and others being fire giants who can breathe water, levitate or chuck lightning?"

Answer: You could say its weird that all horses and donkeys produce mules lol, but they do. And thats kind of how I view it. As stated above im using the ordning as a cemented ground to build upon, and a fun bit of lore given is that each giant while sharing a distant relation to the all father (As long as there in the ordning.) are each kind of their own species. Ettin, Hill, Stone, Frost, Fire, Cloud, Storm (5e). Very similar to how a horse and donkey share a common ancestor and can mate, but produce a offspring that cant reproduce. The only part I didn't keep in this is that while mules are stronger then horses the blue fire giant isn't, But that's because of its own heat (More on that in future answers.)

"Their more unusual abilities are unlikely to be learnt from others of their kind since they're very rare and sterile to boot. There can't be "families" of Blue Fire Giants who teach their kids how to use Blue Fire Torch or Crafting Magic."

Answer: Giants can live for thousands of years, a hybrid could do that all the same (at least that's my head logic), which would give them time to practice their own way. Fire giants dont cast spells but insane crafting ability, but storm giants have magic at will and several spells, which indicates a direct relation to magic. These arnt taught skills either, all lore were given is that its practically genetic, so my thought was "What if these abilities mixed."
So if a BFG (blue fire giant) were to live long enough on its own, it would eventually notice these properties. Also the blue fire torch was suppose tobe a melee weapon with the thrown property, the program I was using didn't save that part. Its also not suppose tobe a spell or anything. its literally the giant grabbing a slab of steel or a tree and it instantly catching on fire.

"All combat questions"
Its because of the thought process that splint can breath and vent heat, while plate would just sit there and slowly melt away. yes the leather would eventually burn but there's alot of ways to craft split that would work well enough for a use or two I would think.
same reasoning behind weapons.
As stated the blue torch was supposed tobe throwable but I didn't notice that the program didn't save that when I uploaded.
The vulnerability is because of something I have experienced where im a very hot blooded person and I can survive the cold easy but warming back up is difficult and its cause alot of issues. Basically these guys are so hot they don't experience the cold so being hit by is magically is a shock to the system. Enough of one to do some real damage.
I agree the saves are a bit much but at the same time that's the mule I guess.
As the answer the charisma question, its because of their storm giant heritage. storm giants are natural at it because of their birth right, so think of bfg as the type of person who hates dealing with people, but that's because they were bullied all their lives, and in truth are really well spoken only because it comes natural to them.
the fire immunity is because of how hot they burn. They are only resistant to the storm giants traits because those traits more or less fueling other things. The best way to describe it is a plasma torch. Its really hot, and can withstand its own fire, but can't absorb pure electricity, only withstand it.

Alot of this could of been described in lore but I was in a run so I just made it quick cause I wanted to stat block reviewed.

as for cr 9, thats just what the cr calculator gave it. I was going for in-between fire and storm with stats but when I calculated all its possible damage hp and armor the calculator said it was cr 9 (originally 7). I could make this thing a lot stronger but I feel like bringing it up to storm giant fully or even past would make it less likely to get used.

 

[Axe11154]

Is this more of a trick to fool the players? I recall a few Dungeon adventures with albino red dragons and such to trick the players into casting protection from cold and then, gotcha, you take fire.

The burning aura part is a bit unwieldly if it burns wood around you and turns stone to lava. You would have a hard time finding a place to live.

As a monster, it is ok and a bit of a scare to a party of 7th level PCs. With the vulnerable to cold things should be ok once the party figures out the trick.

Basically whats going on in the game im using this as a one time encounter, in a homebrew domain of dread. Basically the particular blue fire giant was shunned by the societies they were born from and the parents chose status over family and left him in an island volcano as a baby. Unknown to the parents the volcano the child was left in was being studied by some island living gnomes who upon finding a giant blue baby giggling in lava that it was turning blue, mistook it for a child god. So they began sacrificing pigs to the "god" and slowly the giant grew, its heat producing a beautiful blue magma that would sometimes come out of the vents of the volcano in a wonderous shine. This peace went on for more then a thousand years till suddenly a spelljammer crashed into the volcano.

It was mind flayers. They used their technology to imprison the giant using his heat to power the now damaged ship, and over several years they began sending their collectors to collect the local inhabitants... who were gnomes... to regain their population. Sadly these are gnomes and that means a bunch of gnome Ceremorphs. The elder brain got very tired of this and started planning to invade the world with their army of ceremorphs once they repaired their ship. However... this was thwarted once they were put in the domain of dread.

 

[Cleon]

Answer: You could say its weird that all horses and donkeys produce mules lol, but they do. And thats kind of how I view it. As stated above im using the ordning as a cemented ground to build upon, and a fun bit of lore given is that each giant while sharing a distant relation to the all father (As long as there in the ordning.) are each kind of their own species. Ettin, Hill, Stone, Frost, Fire, Cloud, Storm (5e). Very similar to how a horse and donkey share a common ancestor and can mate, but produce a offspring that cant reproduce. The only part I didn't keep in this is that while mules are stronger then horses the blue fire giant isn't, But that's because of its own heat (More on that in future answers.)

Actually they don't. You only get a mule it the father's a donkey. If the dad's a horse you get a Hinny, which is a bit more horsey than a mule.

Besides, my main issue is some of these abilities look like learned abilities. Unless you're seriously claiming that magically crafting objects from raw material and money is a purely genetically determined trait the description seems a bit off to me.

The previous post indicates this is a unique creature, so why not word the description to reflect that? I'd be fine with it if it wasn't ALL fire giant / storm giant hybrids that came out with this base set of abilities, just these particular ones.

 

[Axe11154]

Actually they don't. You only get a mule it the father's a donkey. If the dad's a horse you get a Hinny, which is a bit more horsey than a mule.

Besides, my main issue is some of these abilities look like learned abilities. Unless you're seriously claiming that magically crafting objects from raw material and money is a purely genetically determined trait the description seems a bit off to me.

The previous post indicates this is a unique creature, so why not word the description to reflect that? I'd be fine with it if it wasn't ALL fire giant / storm giant hybrids that came out with this base set of abilities, just these particular ones.

I am just using it as an example, if you wana get technical fine, then its a bit odd that those two species come out from those mixed combinations, the point still stands. And thats the thing, it is weird, because the giants lore is weird. Storm giants inertly have magic, firegiants have an innate crafting ability. Both species are created in a gods image so it makes since that a combination of them would have some weird abilities. At least in my opinion. Magics weird, goddly magic more so.