D&D 5E (2024) Bonus languages in One D&D backgrounds goes contrary to their other goals

[Yaarel]

If a nonhuman species has a nonhuman trait, like wings, then it is neutral.

But if the the trait is to have a slightly higher intelligence or strength, it is a reallife racist way of thinking.

Any fantasy species does better to have fantasy traits.

 

[Cadence]

If a nonhuman species has a nonhuman trait, like wings, then it is neutral.

But if the the trait is to have a slightly higher intelligence or strength, it is a reallife racist way of thinking.

Any fantasy species does better to have fantasy traits.

Beings can't have nonhuman sizes?
They can't have blatantly nonhuman physiologies (insect and blob in one case)?
We can't give adjustments to physical stats based on having blatantly nonhuman bodies without being racist?
Superhuman strength or dexterity due to being a super-sized insect is bad?
But having wings is ok?

 

[Aldarc]

Beings can't have nonhuman sizes?
They can't have blatantly nonhuman physiologies (insect and blob in one case)?
We can't give adjustments to physical stats based on having blatantly nonhuman bodies without being racist?
Superhuman strength or dexterity due to being a super-sized insect is bad?
But having wings is ok?

Do you think that you are genuinely representing the other side and the issues at stake fairly with your questions that have been answered and explained numerous prior times for you?

 

[Remathilis]

Beings can't have nonhuman sizes?
They can't have blatantly nonhuman physiologies (insect and blob in one case)?
We can't give adjustments to physical stats based on having blatantly nonhuman bodies without being racist?
Superhuman strength or dexterity due to being a super-sized insect is bad?
But having wings is ok?

To be honest, I'm done with the racial ASI arguments. I'm concerned about balancing races when your hands are tied by biology and magical explanations.

You can have a bug race or a blob race or a winged race or an aquatic race and we can justify them because they are non-human and have unique physiology. But how do we balance them against a standard human? Further, how do we make an orc, dwarf, elf or halfling distinct if they have similar bodies and minds to humans. They're basically differently shaped humans with darkvision, biologically speaking.

I guess we can continue to give races more and more magical abilities (tremorsense, teleporting, luck, etc) and have more and more fey-origins and god-blessed races. But I kinda feel it's a pretty small design box to work in.

 

[Ruin Explorer]

Beings can't have nonhuman sizes?

I mean, according to WotC, for the whole of 5E so far, and I think all of 4E?

Not playable ones, no they cannot.

So let's not act like that particular point is novel. You've been able to be size L in 5E from race, and I'm pretty sure (correct me if I'm wrong) not size T either. Nor anything larger.

2E and 3E had some playable size L beings (and larger if we include Council of Wyrms, but that had special rules), but they were hideously unbalanced so I can see why WotC kind of didn't want to mess with that again.

 

[Parmandur]

I think the decision has been made and is not going to be changed by any amount of people on forums “speaking up.” WotC is taking cultural elements out of races in One D&D. Survey feedback will determine what exactly that means. I think whatever the next rules evolution after this one ends up being, that will be the soonest opportunity for that pendulum to swing back.

I think in practice, the final result will be muddled to some degree: Gnomes and Dwarves having tool proficiency is probably going to make it through, even if they have to default to divine formation.

 

[Cadence]

Do you think that you are genuinely representing the other side and the issues at stake fairly with your questions that have been answered and explained numerous prior times for you?

tldr; The previous post was because I was offended and feeling snarky. It didn't help anything, but I felt the urge to post something and did not choose the better part of valor. Read the below a few times and I'm not sure it's helpful, but it's seems better than the last few. In any case I'm dropping it now and will avoid further comment on it.

----

Which other side?

The one that wants old fashioned ASIs for physical and mental stats and doesn't care about how that feels anywhere from icky at the edges to calling up awful racist thoughts? The one that says it's racist thinking to think that physical capabilities are related to physical size but fine that fantasy races often have vastly different sizes? The one that wants mental stats to not vary because that feels exceptionally problematic, and doesn't feel its worth dealing with small physical size differences for physical ones? The one that agrees that a two point ASI doesn't capture much but might like something bigger or caps based on size to be considered for the physical ones? The one that thinks any story of the gods creating races at all in a fantasy story is bad? The one that thinks the gods granting something like luck or perception or some types of languages to their creation is fine, but that granting other languages and any trained skill is bad? The one that's fine with the gods granting anything is fine? The one that wonders why "resourceful, skillful, and versatile" aren't listed among the problematic things too and wants them out? The one that loves all the mixing and matching of different humanoid kinds the way they propose it? The one that finds it really odd that the children of the different kinds of humanoid are just a reskin of one parent or the other? The one that asks why all of those labeled as different types aren't really all one type and so we should do in the concept of race and lineage all together for the reason of allowing creativity? Ditto, but for the sake of avoiding icky parallels to miscegenation laws?

Anyway, I think I'm vaguely well read on the issue. Which is apparently not a preventative for being cheesed off and posting when you shouldn't.

And I'll certainly take getting rid of the physical ASIs since I agree they don't do enough to address anyone's concerns about verisimilitude and because their current implementation raises questions that quickly get to things that get to things well hashed over that shouldn't be gotten to. And I am ecstatic that the mental ASIs are gone. And I am certainly not going to avoid the new edition or make elaborate house rules for it because I'm mad someone's halfling gets to be as strong as my would be paragon of strength orc or whatnot.

But I'm pretty sure I was offended to be told I'm engaged in racist thinking for preferring that strength and maybe dexterity is somewhat related to size (height? build?) . Maybe individual size category and a more fitness stat?

So anyway, I'll try to ignore it from now on and certainly avoid the unhelpful snark about it. <deletes several sentences below that wouldn't be helpful>.

 

[Lanefan]

I’m not a fan of cultural traits from race. If you disagree, you’re welcome to your opinion.

Meh - I'm happy enough to in effect have species and culture more or less tied together for a lot of creatures just for the sake of simplicity if nothing else; with Humans, Elves, Dwarves and Hobbits being the main exceptions who have multiple (and in the case of Humans, many) quite distinct cultures. Which means, when you see a Goblin you've got a fair idea of what makes it tick, unless said Goblin is an exception to the norm.

That said, I don't - and won't - have to worry about expanding and fleshing out cultures for all the once-monster species (Goblin, Orc, Tabaxi, etc.) now being made PC-playable, as such isn't the case in my game.

 

[Charlaquin]

I think in practice, the final result will be muddled to some degree: Gnomes and Dwarves having tool proficiency is probably going to make it through, even if they have to default to divine formation.

Probably true, but I’m still going to be expressing my distaste for that in the survey and encourage others to do the same, in hopes that enough people who feel as I do can sway WotC’s decision.