Building an 11th Level Bard

[Fynn]

Hi All,

Not played a bard in a decade and am unfamilar with the 3.5 rules governing them. I need to build a bard with an overall 10th or 11th level. At this stage cannot decide whether to take bard/rogue or just leave as plain bard.

I'm thinking about using a Whip/Rapier combo and wondering which feats would best support this style of character.

Any help would be most appreciated

Thx FYNN

 

[Jdvn1]

There are some ideas here:
http://www.enworld.org/forums/showthread.php?t=114687

 

[Marimmar]

A Bard is a spellcaster, spellcasters do not multiclass very well. Just concentrate on being good at archery, you won't have enough HPs for melee combat. Your support spells, songs and ranged attacks will make you very well liked in your party unless you're pressed into a role like rogue/tank/healer or artillerist, then your companions will say that you su**.

~Marimmar

 

[The Amazing Dingo]

Bards are flexible, ranged support. They can heal and buff their allies or hamper their opponents. They can also be the pivotal character in a battle.

Nonetheless, their role is strictly support in most every way. As mentioned, it would be best not to engage him in melee, especially using two weapons unless you take a Fighter/Bard multiclass (I can understand Marimmar's statement about not multiclassing a spell-casting class, though I wouldn't really classify the Bard as a spell-casting class (those are wizards, sorcerors, priests, and druids) and a multi-class can add decent options and abilities). If you do Mutli-class to a Fighter/Bard then I'd recommned you do that only for about two levels for those two levels of Feats (Two Weapon if you want to do the Rapier and Whip at once and I think there is a Feat in Complete Warrior or such that gives you more options with those two weapons) because you do still want those spells and skill points from the Bard.

I'd also recommend Human as a class because Bards can make terrific use of Feats. Bards shouldn't specialize, but it doesn't mean a little help in certain areas won't go a long way.

 

[shilsen]

If you're thinking about PrCs, there are a couple of nice bard-oriented ones in Complete Arcane (and probably in Complete Adventurer, which I haven't looked at).

 

[Marimmar]

I don't recommend multiclassing Bards because they are essentially a multiclass character. They already can do everything in a mediocre way and to multiclass into anything else will just lower the bardic music abilities and cripple spell levels even more. Same goes for Sorcerer, I'd never recommend multiclassing with them; they already hang back half a spell level compared to Wizards.

Multiclassing into Fighter to get some Feats ain't worth it IMHO, just wait a while and those Feats will be yours without reducing your highest spell level. A whole level of spells is worth a lot more than two Feats.

~Marimmar

 

[Merlion]

A Bard is a spellcaster, spellcasters do not multiclass very well. Just concentrate on being good at archery

Although the removal of MW/GMW from their spell list in 3.5 makes this more diffacult, unless and until you can get a magic bow.


But yea, archery or the whip are the only really good options for the Bard. Using the whip to trip and disarm etc.


I really think the Bard should have at least some tiny deccent offense capability...hmmm...

 

[The Amazing Dingo]

Flynn seemed more interested in martial abilities then magical, so two levels of Fighter for the extra BAB, HD, and Feats mixes well with that he'd like in terms of a character. Two levels for Bard can be big (and I'd never ever recommend multi-classing a sorceror either) but if he's preferring the martial aspect, then I'd recommend those two levels in Fighter still.

 

[taliesin15]

Improved Initiative right off the bat.

As to some of the responses, especially multiclassing, what I would suggest is Ranger/Bard rather than Fighter--just seems like it goes better.

I just built up a Bard/Wizard character recently, a Wizard whose school is Divination, making all those information based spells work really well with the Bard skills. The Bard skills help the Wizard on the whole Magic Research angle--I look at this character as a kind of Sage in Training.

 

[Keepiru]

Seeker

If you'd like to do a bit more with your bardic music abilities in combat, you may want to look at the Seeker of the Song class from the Complete Arcane. At 11th level you'd only be able to do the 1st level of the seeker due to the pre-reqs on skill ranks. As soon as you level though, you get a great ability that lets you start 2 songs at once and maintain them both. So you could Inspire Courage and Inspire Greatness in the same round. Most of the seeker songs have special secondary attacks that you can activate on the next round after you started a song.

If you're looking for more melee focused stuff, you might want to pick up the spell "Phantom Steed" to give yourself a very fast mount that can walk on water, air walk, and fly at 14th level. Its movement speed is pretty high, so you could stay at max range firing a bow all day. Just don't get hit because it only has a handful of hp's and takes 10 mins to summon. I had one fireballed out from under me but luckily I landed on top of the city wall instead of in the river =P

Lingering song is a good feat to have for long fights so that your buffs last longer. Fire off your two melee songs with the seeker ability in the first round, then spend the next 9 rounds meleeing before you have to refresh your songs.

Perform:Singing would be a good choice for your bard so that you don't have to have your hands on an instrument to start your music. Nothing like trying to make an AoO with a mandolin!

Complete adventurer has a feat for Damage reduction 5 that may come in handy for low hp bards.

I'm playing a 14 bard / 2 Seeker of the song in a combat heavy campaign and the benefits from being able to use the combine song ability alone is worth it for taking the PrC. I'm looking forward to getting a few more of the seeker songs for more spell-like attacks.